4 significant Cubase 8 issues I'm seeing

I turned off ASIO guard and my CPU meter went down. It’s at about 30% in the current project I’m working on (with ASIO guard on, it was at approximately 50%). Maybe my computer has no need for ASIO guard. Why does ASIO guard exist again?

If I turn off ASIO guard my CPU goes down a small amount 4-5% or so. If you are working completely ITB within Cubase at a high buffer length ASIO guard and thus the new performance improvements relating to it probably aren’t going to do anything for you. Where ASIO guard comes in handy is once you start trying to lower your latency for recording or controller input.

It is ahead of time, but relative to what you are hearing. AsioGuard is preprocessing the playback tracks, including any plugins and whatever else it can handle, so that any latency that the latter would have caused is mitigated.

To be done fully, that process would have to test render everything, to know what the maximum delay is going to be, and adjust the playback delay so that sudden peaks in processing don’t cause hiccups.

I suppose that is why AsioGuard can really only handle certain types of processing, without the benefit of such full-rendering lookahead.

It is like plugin delay compensation, but that process benefits from knowing the plugin’s latency beforehand, because it queries it for that. That reported latency has to be its worst case, otherwise there would also be opportunities for hiccups.

Really, thinking about it, I am beginning to wonder where PDC ends and AG begins, or is AG using PDC as part of its calculations? It all seemed so clear when JMCecil explained it! I am obviously still missing something in my understanding of it.

Ahh ok - so it’s mainly for when you’re trying to record with extreme low latency then? That makes more sense… I just use direct monitoring in the RME mixer for that - although I suppose being able to monitor through plugins with extreme low latency is pretty cool. I pretty much never lower my buffer below 512 or so… I’ve always been paranoid about potential clicks/pops. At 512, I haven’t had any issues… it’s always been amazing on my system.

Well… I might try to use ASIO guard sometime if I’m aiming to track through plugins at super low latency or something. Thank you Great for clarifying.

-Todd

At what sample rate?

I record at 192k with a 256 sample buffer, giving 1.3ms recording delay and 4ms round trip.
To get the same figures at 44.1k, the buffer would have to be 256 /192 * 44.1 = 59.

Up until now, I haven’t been able to record at a 192 sample buffer, but I will get round to trying it with the new AG. I don’t expect much because even when I got a new system with 50%+ more grunt, I couldn’t budge lower than the 256.

Once I start the mixing, with Ozone et al, I am up to the max 2048 sample buffer allowed by the RME driver, which is why we had to upgrade the comp to get more CPU headroom.

I’ve found there is a sweet spot with ASIO Guard 2.

For example, a 2048 buffer won’t work with ASIO Guard 2 at all. It gives a message to that effect. This is a useful nugget, perhaps, for those who don’t have an audio interface with a driver that goes that high (most don’t). If you’ve been dreaming of getting a new audio interface with 2048 drivers (like the Focusrite lineup), you may not need to, thanks to ASIO Gaurd 2, so read on…

Dropping to 1024 will work. One might think that this being the highest buffer, would give the best CPU performance with its higher latency tradeoff, but this wasn’t the case for me. It showed a higher Ave and Peak than 512, 256 and even 128! Very non-intuitive.

I also found that the real CPU usage (not ASIO usage) doesn’t vary much between the buffer settings. Slightly, but not much.

For me, the sweet spot for best ASIO performance (not caring about latency) was 512, with almost zero red clip lights. This was on a project that in 7.5, required 2048 to even play at all.

256 was very usable, but with some slight red clips.

128 was also, amazingly, useable, but not perfect. In a pinch for doing a part that required recording at low latency and not caring about an overload, it would work great.

So I would say to those with monster projects, 1024 buffer and beyond, that are having trouble with ASIO Guard, to try at 512 (or even 256) before dismissing it. For me, both 512 and even 256 had a lower ASIO meter than 1024. It’s just crazy.

At 44.1k?

With RME Fireface drivers, the min and max buffer sizes for different sample rates are:
32k, 44.1k, 48k = 48 - 1024
64k, 88.2k, 96k = 96 - 2048
128k, 176.4k 192k = 192 - 2048

Just when we thought it was safe to use our rules-of-thumb! :cry:

Now we all have to go experwimenting (we were hunting wabbits).

Also another reason not to use ASIO guard is if, like me, you’re recording without the need for software monitoring (guitar amp in the same or nearby room that you can hear) or if you’re using real time hardware monitoring.

I’m very much not educated on all that ASIO guard does, once I get things completely set up and installed with Cubase 8 I’m gonna read up on it and see if it’s right for my workflow. The thing that does affect my workflow is MIDI latency, which I work around by having my master controller patched into my mixer so I get direct output. So I basically record a softsynth while listening to a hardware synth.

I don’t know how possible it is but I would love to have two separate ASIO streams running within Cubase, one for audio and one for MIDI, since I have 4 audio interfaces installed in my system (between PCI cards, workstation keyboards and USB devices like AxeFX and Eleven Rack). It’s unfortunate that all installed hardware is slaved to the buffer of the main ASIO driver.

Recorded tracks are read ahead, in this context that’s what delay compensated results in … we were adding what a sampler does on sample conversion to match project settings.

I disagree. The font on my 4k tv display were so small previously I could barely read them. Now it looks very legible and clear. Huge improvement on my system

Yes, 44.1k on a Focusrite Saffire Pro 40.

Us non-4k users need the small fonts, while you guys need large ones to balance it out. Solution: let the users determine the GUI elements

To start in safe mode:

1: Start Cubase as usual.

2: When the splash screen first appears, press Control-Alt-Shift simultaneously. (Mac uses the equivalent Mac keys.)

3: From the popup screen choose the desired option. You get three choices. Use current preferences, disable current preferences and delete current preferences. I’d disable the preferences file first, then if that solves the problem, start it up again in the same way and delete the old preferences. Makes it really easy.

It’s a good idea to save your VST connections settings as presets before you do this to make sure you can call up your working hardware setup without having to rebuild it.

Hello guys,

Cubase 8 has shown and proven to offer slightly better performance than previous versions. That is a fact.
I won’t start a discussion about ASIO Guard 2 should be active or inactive in your system. That is something that you need to decide by yourself individually as we are talking about individual setups, especially in studios or if you are working on huge projects.
My experience with cases where people use a non-simple setup (such as big studios) is that they will probably get rid of many issues only after setting up Cubase from Scratch or resetting the preferences.
Please try at least safe start mode and then let us know how your experience was. By comparing both results (with and without preferences) it will be easier to help you troubleshooting issues.

All the best,

Apologies for the lack of participation since starting this thread. I had to go back to Nuendo to get some work finished and didn’t want to chime in unless I had something useful to add.

I’ve just given Cubase 8 another go and have had mixed fortunes in getting it to behave.

  1. As Noiseyboy suggested, I upped the Asioguard setting to ‘Max’. This does indeed improve the VST performance which Cubase reports, such that it is roughly in line with Cubase 7.5 and Nuendo 6.5. If there’s a CPU gain, then it certainly isn’t significant on my system (going off the average load meter), but it looks like it isn’t any worse than earlier versions. This is good news.

  2. Unfortunately an equally significant issue has made itself known as I’ve played with it a little more. I work with the Project window on one monitor and the Key editor and Mixer on my second monitor. When a project is running, if I click on either the Project Window or Key Editor (when moving from the other) I lose audio altogether for around 2-3 seconds. This would make it very hard for me to work as I flit between these windows making minor tweaks and edits all the time. Perhaps there’s a setting I have missed which might be causing this? For whatever reason, just changing the window focus is causing the audio-engine to do something which causes audio to be lost, and I can also see that the cursor staggers or stops completely whilst this is happening.

  3. The GUI issues I reported in my original post are unchanged. The Cubase menu bar now appears on my second monitor and is often just a solid white bar with no menu headings unless I move my cursor over it. The task bar, which is set to auto-hide on my first monitor, does not appear at all. I presume these issues are related to the need to now use Aero.

Thanks for all the feedback on this thread. Hopefully these issues can be worked out in a quick interim build.

Jules

PS. Prior to running Cubase and seeing the results above, I disabled preferences in Safe Mode, as suggested.

You are far too technical for me. I have problem and was hoping that someone would help but in simple terms. I have C8. My issues are with delays , echoes. I plug my guitar or microphone through the focusrite and happily record songs for my ears only. When i use vocal or guitarcpre sets with effects ( echo/ delay) i get a drop out. It’s as if there an interruption to the power supply. It’s only milliseconds but nevertheless it renders the project useless. Sorry for the neanderthal level of understanding. Please help if you can. Cheers Ed.