A gain staging question. (solved)

Hi, I’ve been making an effort to get my gain staging in order and have this problem…is there any way to see if a signal is coming in too hot without inserting a plugin? for instance a klanghelm meter. I like to use as few plugins as possible (i get confused easily :confused: ) and would be quite happy to adjust the input using the pre gain knob but how to find the signal level without inserting a plugin?

cheers for any advice, :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

best, Kevin :slight_smile:

Hi. Meters can be set to display Input, Post Fader or Post Panner. If clipping is happenning on input you might not see it if the Control Room meter is set to Post. Figguring out gain staging is an art. The more tracks in the project the lower the per track db has to be. Sometimes I start at -18 per track for a 12 track project with the meter set to Input. If I hug peak on each track I end up with Input clipping on the Stereo Out. I’m not a pro so I hope some of the more experienced folks will weigh in on this.

Just look at the input meters in Cubase, no need for any plugin ?

Ok guys…thank you, something strange though (which I’m sure is down to my stupidity) when the faders are set to input I am unable to turn the signal down :confused: :confused: I move the faders and the signal stays at the same level…
what am I not getting?

best, kevin :slight_smile:

Looking at the manual and it says if the input meter position is selected it is post input gain…how is one supposed to attenuate this signal :question: :confused: :confused:

Use the “Pre-Gain” slider in the “Pre” rack to attenuate the signal with all inserts bypassed using post-fader metering. If you really want to see the meter reflected white using input metering you would have to lower the level using individual clip gain.

Wait are you talking about input level during tracking or while setting up a mix?

Yes, I am using this but it doesn’t seem to attenuate the input signal according to what the fader reading is showing…it turns the sound up or down but the levels shown in the fader region stays in the red…ie…does not move either way…this is with faders set to input…

thanks for your input… :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

best, Kevin :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

while setting up a mix at the mo but need to figure out both I s’pose :slight_smile:

For input metering while tracking you should use the input meters on the input tracks routed from your device.

Setting up a mix I usually start by trimming (Pre-Gain slider) shooting for between -12 to -8db. This is before adding inserts so I get an input meter display using post-fader metering.

Hi Kevin.

If you set your track for input monitoring, you need to set up the gain with input channel (red faders in mix console), or even better set the gain on your interface.

You are monitoring the input, that’s why the actual track fader makes no difference.

Every time I ask a question on this forum you intelligent guys make me realise what an absolute knob head i am when it comes to this tekky stuff…

thank you, I’m such an idiot, I thought everything was in the box, can you believe I was not looking at the input on my Yamaha N8 :laughing: :laughing: :unamused: :unamused:

you guy’s must be embarrassed to be a member of the same forum as me… :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

thanks again…

best, Kevin :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

However…still confused…I have a track with Nexus on it…I can adjust the input volume using my Yamaha N8 but it makes no difference to the apparent volume on the meters in the mixer…whether thy are set to input or not…shouldn’t the volume in the mixer go up or down?

What is the track routed out to?

Nexus the virtual instrument ?
Adjust it on the instruments output.
When I used it years ago, I loaded the patches I would use regularly and saved them again with the output turned down -12db. The patches are all ridiculously loud.
It’s always a good idea to start the gain staging at the source, if it is a microphone start with the preamp, if it is a virtual instrument start at its output. And never record to hot.
Some plugins that are modeled after hardware do their job best at -18dbfs, louder than that they begin to distort, what not in itself is a bad thing, if you like the sound.
If you regularly record tracks hot, by mistake or other circumstance, then use 32bitfloat instead of 24bit when recording. Then you can get the peaks back by lowering the volume, in 24bit they would have been cut of and can’t be restored.

There is some excellent stuff from quick setup to lengthy tutorials and explanations on gain staging in just about every daw you can think of on you tube, though the basics are the same. Would be well worth you watching a few.

Ok guys, this has been a big learning step for me, I never realised that the faders needed to be set to input, I thought they just worked and gave an indication of signal level, so I was recording everything hot because i was adjusting the signal level with the faders set at their default…I’ve been recording everything using 32 bit float so as peakae says, hopefully reducing the volume by pulling it down on the actual event I think…i should recover the peaks…yes?
is there an easier way to set the faders to input? It would be nice to have a button at the top of the fader…

never realised the faders are so useless set at their default :frowning: :frowning:

you guys have been so helpful, I thank you all sincerely :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

best, Kevin :slight_smile:

Hey Kevin. Embrace the relativity! Anticipate a new dilema. Enjoy the breakthroughs! We are dabbling in the domain of brilliant engineers. :smiley:

Trying…definitely trying, :sunglasses: :sunglasses: :slight_smile: :slight_smile: