A long read but a good one! Brotherhood opinions sought

Suppose you’re in a relationship & living with a woman for 5 years now, and overall, it’s gone really well, with the exception of a number of times whereby she and her Mother have talked privately about you at length, without letting you know anything that has been said or discussed, and even make plans that involve & include you, again, all the while not telling you anything until the very last minute, if at all.

Moreover, this includes some unfair & nasty things being thrown at you from your [not quite] Mother in law by way of your common law wife – in other words indirectly, that have been both insulting. demeaning & hurtful – all without just cause or provocation.

If that’s not enough, you’ve heard your Mother in law say right to your face ‘how good you are for her daughter, and how you’ve even helped the whole family by way of your presence & efforts so far’ - this from doing very many things for her & 2 other family members, thus making you very confused.

Anyway, as time passes, your wife & you both agreed that you’ve outgrown the place you’re renting, and she basically says “'I want to move - I hate it here”.

So you think to yourself, ‘Ok, we’ll be moving soon - most likely next spring or summer’, and you 'put it on the shelf for now’, knowing that moving day will be something you’ll need to focus on before long.

Then just a week or so later, she goes house shopping not with you, but with her Mother, whom;

A) periodically – every 6 months or so – has caused you untold levels of grief, frustration, anger, hurt & even insults and has ruined your reputation long before you could ever establish it within their family, leaving you ‘in a pile of piss’ that isn’t even yours;

B) You have mentioned to your common-law wife of 5 years that “Your Mother is too overbearing, doesn’t know her boundaries & I don’t want your Mother picking out a place for us to live. We can do that ourselves, just like we’ve done before”.

Your wife agrees, because whenever her Mother has ‘pissed all over’ you in the past, she was also equally outraged and perturbed about it each time it happened – or so it appeared.

So no surprise that you don’t want your [almost] Mother-in law involved in any decision making in your life, especially something so important, detailed, expensive and arduous as a place to move to and possibly buy.

But next thing you know, you find out that your wife’s been looking WITHOUT YOU for the last 12 days with her Mother - I repeat, WITH HER MOTHER, and they pick a place to buy - not to rent - TO BUY - all without including you in any shopping around, viewings, input, suggestions, questions, measurements & any & all decisions.

She finally tells you about it, after her Mother, her realtor and her have their hearts set on it, but then ignores any logic, wisdom, suggestions and alternative ideas you mention, including and especially why you’re upset and even incensed about the whole process of exclusion.

Although her realtor has shown her a number of places on-line, it is the one and only place she’s actually gone & physically looked at and sure as shootin’ she’s going to buy this place with or without you. In other words, she’s buying the first & only place she’s looked at.

In fact, the paper work is all ready to be signed – and I know she’s gonna sign it - [FYI ,my signature is not required on the documents].

Now - how would you feel about all this?

Which way would that turn your crank?

Positive; negative; other?

Especially if you had a life long history of being invalidated by many, many people in your past – mostly women including your own Mother, your sister, your ex-wife - and she - your common law wife knows this all to well and has in the past been compassionate & understanding towards you about this - even though she as done this to you several times as well.

As a heads up, I told her I absolutely refuse to move in with her, just out of sure spite alone, for purposely being left out of the entire process from start to almost finish.

So now be honest - be brutally honest!

What would your thoughts & feelings be?

How about some comments you might say to her?

Am I in the wrong? Is she?

She finally showed me the place.

Some of the rooms are to small, there are strata fees for cutting almost no grass, shoveling almost never any snow, and cleaning cutters without any tall trees in sight for miles.

Worst of all and most important, there are 27 stairs from top to bottom.

I’m 53, and after a lifetime of construction as an Electrician since just 3 weeks out of high school, she knows my knees are bad, to the point where I’m even having trouble going up & down an 8’ ladder now after just few times up & down it.

But again, I tell ya’, she’s gonna go ahead & buy it with or without me, because she has what’s known as ‘new car smell syndrome’, which more often than not, leads to ‘buyers remorse’ - something I’m trying to caution her about, but like many women, now refuses to listen to anything I say - even being late to the party.

Thank you for your honesty Buds,


Cue up Run, Run, Run by Jo Jo Gunne.

If you don’t want to be maligned, stabbed in the back, and worse … run, run, run.

If you don’t want a treacherous Monster-In-Law … run, run, run.

Are you running yet?

PS - down here in most states, “common law” is seven years of cohabitation (not five).

Given that I’m going through a divorce that isn’t so nice right now (still don’t have my studio PC back grrrr), the following joke is rather appropriate…

Seen on a t-shirt:

“Woman: if they didn’t have a vagina, they’d have a bounty on their heads.”


Sounds like she makes it clear in word and action that your needs don’t figure into her life choices.

The ball is in your court. Move with her into this place and you are sending the message that it’s okay. It makes no difference what you say, or what she says, only the action counts.

The question is, do you have the intestinal fortitude to deal with your grief if you leave her? And can you learn to recognize actual loving behavior when you see it in the future? I know I have struggled with that.

Or, maybe you’ll get lucky and mom in law will get run over by a reindeer this Christmas season. :wink: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfSb6J4jhcU

just go with the flow and keep her on as cook and cleaner, let her go play with her mum and you find another woman to play with on the side ,cake and eat it.lol

Great responses so far Buds.


You are not wrong. Neither is she. The question is where the focus is on.
If being alone and with what you do is fine for you, that is great. And i mean it. But it can be disturbing for people who can not be that way, certainly if they have to share time and space with you.
Most musicians i know of are very focussed on their own life and profile. Again… that is ok, and i am too.
But it can be difficult if there is no common ground for that in a relationship.

The essence of a relation should be discussed within the relation, and if not, probably people are talking about how to deal with what is meant to be a relation. I really left behind the thought that a relation is the ideal many years ago.
It is indeed the means to reproduce, but if that is not possible on normal conditions, you better leave that to other people who want to endure the consequences. :slight_smile:

hope you get the peaces back together,
kind regards,

Thanks Guys - it’s a very complicated situation - much more complicated than one would think, but I did go for a 45 minute drive today to look at a place of mine own to rent

Man, what tangled web you’re in. If I was in your situation, and financially independent, I would, as swamptone suggested, run.
Of course there are other factors to consider, such as ‘love’ and emotional dependency, can you live, even reasonably happily, without her?

Other than that, I can only wish you well, and hope you can somehow balance the scales,


Aloha Jim, this is a tough one.

I’m 53 with a life long history of being invalidated by many, many people

How much time is left in your life for you to keep going thru this?

But again, I tell ya’, she’s gonna go ahead & buy it with or without me,

Kinda spells it out doesn’t it?

I did go for a 45 minute drive today to look at a place of mine own to rent

‘nuff said’. The wheels are in motion.

Here in Hawaii we have a word called: ‘Pono’.
It means even tho’ it is hard; to ‘do the right thing’; which I am sure you eventually will.

Good luck!
and I really mean that from the bottom of my heart.

Not to sound callous but if you write music at all,
try and get all these feelings and emotions down in
music form. It might help.


Sounds like three in your relationship at the mo and you are being set aside, not saying you have to go but you seem have to set a “deal breaker” anyway

have a break if that is what it takes, i would.

well and truly the mother in law should have told her daughter to talk to you and not leave you out even if she doesn’t like you anymore - whatever the reason - its just respect. only saying this as there are two sides to a story. for some reason they have locked you out.

the mind will always play tricks on you in this situation (!) fight fire with fire, both of you dig your heals in etc, but you may find you are playing into your mother inlaws hands.

women are barmy creatures though- she probably feels some way about the situation, but has support, a confidant to edge her along

and when you have two in co-hoots. :smiling_imp: … i dont think you will be able to talk any sense to each other let alone come to an understanding . for now anyway. she may have to recognise your absence before she can see. …or not

oh the other thing… I would check myself, could I have done anything better? just sayin

Collaborations only work when everyone listens to each other .
Communication is only possible between equals .

A good woman is hard to find. The perfect woman doesn’t exist. The perfect relationship doesn’t exist.
Mother in laws are always in everybody’s business. If you love her enough I’m sure you’ll work it out.

I don’t think it’s worth breaking up over this. Some women are what you call mama’s girl they stay at home until you move her out / marry her and buy the fancy house and wedding. Trust me bro I know. Consider yourself lucky that she’s independent for the exception of the mother in law.

I agree that you should be included in the process. My advice, talk to her and go look at other places better suited for you ASAP. Or better yet go find a few places fast and take her with you without the mother in law.
Put your foot down and tell her to keep the mother in law out of your life/business. Keep a cool head about this
it’s a important move. No drama… Set the mood.

Some men are okay with the wife being the boss. Some women are okay with the men being the boss. Some relationships are 50/50 those are the best. When if comes to buying a place it should be 50/50.

Good luck :smiley:

Thanks for all your support guys.

I’ve been MIA - away for a few days.

She just had major surgery on Nov. 19, and I’ve been at the hospital for 2 straight days, plus the night before, guess who had to stay over?

So I’ve not been able to read anything here for a few days, and I’m posting this without reading anything added lately, which I will do afterwards.

In case anyone’s still interested, there are a few things that make this more complicated:

Complication # 1. She’s partially handicapped because of a horrendous car crash when she was just 7 years old. This gave her permanent injuries - no use of her left arm, and a walk with a limp.
She also suffered a small head injury, because not only didn’t her Dad put a seat belt on her - she didn’t even have a seat! Just a chair in a van.

A woman in oncoming traffic fell asleep at the wheel on the highway, and had crossed the yellow line.

Her Dad swerved to avoid her, but at 100 KMH - [60MPH] the van caught the dirt shoulder embankment and tumbled over & over. She was tossed around like rag doll and eventually literally flew out the van, hitting her head first, which is believed to be what opened the back van door that she then flew out of.

But other than her obvious physical injuries, no one would think she had a head injury. She’s very well spoken and quite articulate.

Before we met, she had been attacked several times and severally taken advantage of - [imagine judgment day for those who do things to a tiny, defenseless handicapped woman who can neither run away nor fight off any attacker - that can’t end well for them!].

In fact, when she came to me, the first thing she said she need wasn’t a boyfriend, room mate or husband - but a protector.

I felt much compassion & empathy for her. Then of course we started getting along a bit too well, and - well - you know how that goes.

So I’ve been taking care of her for the past 5 years, she’s very proud and delighted to introduce me as her husband and no one’s even come close to doing anything to her - [oh except for one guy - reminds me - I still gotta deal with him].

Both her and her Mother have spoken many times to my face extolling my virtues and their appreciation in ‘rescuing her’ from a world that is continually hard, physically abusive & just downright terrible to her, and for keeping her safe, warm & happy since.

Because of my concern, efforts & subsequent love for, her confidence & self-assuredness has grown for the 1st time ever in her life - to the point where she’s lost 100 pounds on the treadmill I bought her, now often doing 2-3 miles a day on it, and is down to her ideal weight.
She also volunteers a few places which she’s always wanted to do.

So overall we’ve had a superb relationship - all until she went and bought an iphone 5.

This where and how she’s reconnected with her Mother, which I would never normally be against - except for how the last last 3 years has gone with them 2.

As trouble has progressed, I told her, “You know, we were perfectly happy once - until you bought your effen’ iphone”.

She actually agreed, but did that change anything? - no.

The 2 of them are glued to them. Before that, she barely had any contact with her Mother - and we were happy.

I’ve even told her numerous times, “You know, if we part & go our own separate ways, it’ll be because of your Mother and you!”

Complication # 2. My health has deteriorated drastically over the past 2 years - [gee, wonder why?], and I’ve been reduced to working just one day a week, or less. I might have fibromyalgia, which hits fewer men than women.

In her compassionate stages, which is most of the time, she’s quite concerned and vows to take care of me for the rest of my life, promising to never put me in an old age home 10, 20 or 30 years from now, should things get progressively worse.

So at this point in time, I have neither the physical health nor the spondulicks needed to actually up & move out - not just yet anyway.

I’ve been doing a lot of thinking - too much perhaps, and have decided that despite her offer, I cannot stay in an unhealthy relationship that’s damn near killing me.

Before I ‘rescued her 5 years ago’, my mental/emotional and physical health were all excellent. Now they’ve all gone for shit!

So as she’s been getting better, and I’ve been getting worse.

I’ve started working on plans to live alone again - something that ALWAYS makes me happy. I did this when I left my ex-wife and boy did it pay off big time - even though I had to walk away from $50,000 or more. But before long, I couldn’t be happier.

Here we go again I guess.

Unfortunately, I am stuck here until my finances improve, which I expect will take some time.

So I’m gonna have to tough it out, and just ‘detach’ from her, which is not want I would have wanted, but I don’t see any other choice.

I also don’t see this relationship as salvageable anymore, despite the mention of counseling.

Seems too much damage has been done, and now my mental, emotional & physical heath have suffered from it all. No wonder I haven’t done any music for about a year now.

I need to take care of myself. So I’ve just gone into self-repair mode.

To bad I’m gonna have to break her heart next year, but the thought of living alone again and focusing solely on my music & motorcycles sure has a nice ring to it!

Thanks again for the support Buds.


I respect you for all you have done in your relationship
and I wish you (and her) a very happy and healthy future.

Sending much Aloha.


I’ve read this thread carefully. A big signal was her knowing you have bad knees and nevertheless choosing a place with many steps. I’m sure you have pointed this out to her. Her assurances that she’ll look after you cannot be relied on - even if ‘she by herself’ would have, her alliance with her mother shows no signs of abating. I confirm - from outside your head - that you have thought all this through thoroughly and have established your exit strategy. Will she, realising that you are distancing, find what she needs to ‘choose you over her mother’? If so, then review is possible, but at this time you sound like you have your ducks in a row.

I see no false optimism nor pessimism. I also see your strength of independence in this matter may well be the best support you can give her to find her independence from her mother, to experience the solid consequences of her actions. You can do no more, and, if you do part from her, then inno way can you be said to have abandoned her. She will have chosen to abandon herself, and in so doing, will have lost you.

You have my sympathies and respect, Jamusic.

Take care

cut the relationship !

buy more vst’s and write a great “breakup” track

Hahaha! All needed/wanted Vsts are now purchased!

Thanks so much Glyn, curteye and all the other replies.

Whoever said these forums weren’t friendly is dead wrong.

I really appreciate all the time taken to write such great replies, which I’ve read with great interest.

Went to see the Doctor today, and told him she’s killing me from the inside out.

Then I called 2 counselors to make appointments just to make sure I’m not exaggerating and that I have things straight.

Spoke to a 3rd one who gave me about 15 minutes of her time free, and she said basically what some of you have said in one way or another

  • no respect = no relationship.

She also agreed that her & her Mother are unlikely to change & said sounds like you already know the answer - you just might need a little push to move from the comfort zone of 5 years living there.

Feeling better already - making plans & just moving forward regardless of the slow starting speed.

Feeling confident and looking forward to better days now.