A open plea to Steinberg... again....

I was disappointed, greatly, by the Steinberg response. “You users speak, we listen” isn’t the impression I was left with after reading the poll.

I expected to see things like an acknowledgement of the CPU and other very important issues, and also asking us to rank the bug list.

I was also hoping the very sparse Steinberg presence on the forums would increase, so there would be respectful, even creative dialog between Steinberg and the user community.

I so much want some of the C8 and 8.5 features, but no way I’m leaving my very smoothly functioning 7.5.40 to get them … until those major problems are resolved.

I could be wrong but…

I read their initial response as being that they ARE AWARE of the bugs and would be working on those, but that they are ALSO listening to us on things that Cubase needs (in our opinions). So while they are working on updates to fix the bugs, they would ALSO focus on some of the most desired features.

Realistically everything listed seemed to be a feature. Therefore, it would make great sense to conclude that they are working on “fix” releases in the meantime. The fact that they are bothering at all to look at features before another major release is pretty amazing.

Having been a dev before, I wish everyone appreciated how important it is to a dev to fix bugs. I don’t think Steinberg is jerking anyone around. But they not only have to reproduce the bug, they have to determine what impact a fix may have on some other “well working” part of the product.

It is like working on a VW (keeping things all German here)…you can replace the water pump. But you better replace the timing belt and pullys while you are at it, or there will be different issues to arise down the road. So a “tiny” fix could amount to an astronomical change in the entire structure of the product.

Cubase works well for me. There are a few small issues. And every DAW I use (see signature) has SOMETHING that is an issue…strike that…MANY SOMETHINGS that are issues.

I am confident they are aware of their issues and are working on them.

All makes sense to me.

Hopefully you are right. Unfortunately, they’ve said nothing to indicate this is the case. So far, this is the sum total of the communication between Them and Us. “We hear you, we’ve listened, and here is our response - ta da”. Hence this thread really. They responded before, they should respond again. If this is just a small part of their battle plan, if they have all (or nearly all) our other issues already prioritised and taken care of… well for heaven’s sake tell us. Give us the details. An inappropriate public poll open to obvious abuse and a couple of paragraphs is hardly a major company / customer communciations breakthrough, is it?

(Oh, and not sure the VW analogy is necessarily helping their cause…)

Still can’t help but see only an Ivory Tower.

Thank you. Keep it up, and I hope you stay focused on your plea. You have my vote.

I think for everyone there are “features” and then there are features. The dividing line can certainly be gray. There are features that center on core functions such as mix undo that if implemented properly, I would love and think it’s past due. Maybe this is “usability enhancement” and not features?

On the flip side there are “features” that are just…I won’t describe it since I think you and others know. And then toss in the features often achieved better by 3rd parties. This isn’t about personal preferences. IMO it’s about what makes a DAW pro and stand out above other DAWS. It’s what has made Pro Tools the “industry standard”…so far…

I hope users might be able to better define features as there seems to be a bit of misunderstanding with the use of that term?

I too was a bit disappointed by the survey since it had NOTHING to do with what was being discussed in the original open plea thread. The feature list they had was pretty cool, yes. But the main concern were always the standing bugs.

Steinberg, I thought the survey was gonna be about prioritizing bug fixes. What happened?

Also no option for MIDI improvements, at all. I did write in my hope for improved controller editing and generation, which frankly for me is more than twice as important as anything else. But obviously the poll is going to skew in favor of the already given choices, so I’m not sure how useful that is.

Well ladies and gentleman, the lack of any kind of response by anyone from Steinberg - even a trivial one - means sadly I think we have our answer. In other words - Steinberg Hath Spoken. There will be no serious re-evaluation of priorities, no period of consolidation. There will be no increased dialogue with customers, no increased openness about a bug fix schedule.

This has proven to be what the cynics said all along - a little PR stunt to placate the masses. Feel slightly irritated with myself that I thought it might have substance.

Oh well.

For me, I’m unlikely to switch from Cubase - it’s still the only game in town which can control midi CC over EuCon. Few others will have such specific needs to stay with them of course.

Reading this thread, this is how you would think it works at Steinberg HQ:

Head developer goes into the bosses office and says “Hey boss, I’d like to spend some time fixing a few bugs for our wonderful customers. I could probably have it done in a day or two. What do ya reckon?”. The boss says “Naaah, screw those s**ty customers. Just give those stupid idiots Mixer Undo, Multitrack Variaudio editing, Bezier automation curves and a bunch of other crap. That’ll shut those fools up while we milk another 100 euros from their pathetic little wallets.”

You meaning ‘one poster’ ‘yourself’ or just how it works? lol! Funny either way. :slight_smile:

It is seriously disheartening that many have issues. I am a lucky one that doesn’t. Yep, there are a few glitches here and there but for the most part the software is reliable for me. Another user with a different system from mine can have issues.

Windows and Mac have different issues. I decided to not upgrade this time as W7 and Cubase 8 is working just fine for me.

Best to you all. Seriously. :slight_smile:

I’ve seen the same thing on other DAWs, and it’s the same story. Unfortunately, the grass ain’t greener elsewhere. Why is it so hard for a software company to really tackle these bugs, and just that?

Whatever, I’m not upgrading again until I see some real bug fixing. Cubase 8.5 does everything I could ever want and more. Honestly, I was upgrading more to support a great company, but this reaction (or lack thereof) from Steinberg has negatively affected my perception of them. No more!

Dear forum members,

Thanks a lot for the great response we’ve been getting from our customer feedback survey! More than 1,000 Cubase users took part in the survey in the first few days and provided valuable feedback and comments to the topics we compiled from this and other forums as well as from frequently asked questions, issues and requests from our support and user-base.

Some of you are wondering why we’ve listed possible features in the survey and haven’t focused on special issues. As others here in the forum have stated: it is obvious for us that we constantly work on and fix issues that, by the way, are found well-documented in the Collected Issues thread. If you have any comments you would like to add to the survey, please feel free to enter these in the available comment field at the end of the survey. That’s why we put it there. Rest assured that we’re open to your suggestions and concerns.

Tim - while it’s nice to read that you’re open to suggestions, it seems a great many of us aren’t really seeing much evidence of it. The original thread asked for a period of consolidation - bug fixes and smaller useful updates, and a great many of them. While it could be argued some of the features in the survey come into the latter category, it seems to have wilfully missed the main thrust of that thread by choosing between only 16 of often substantial new features. No-one in that thread has been calling for a new sampler, for example - that’s exactly the kind of resource-black hole I’d want to avoid. We could have 50 small but significant improvements, or a new sampler, say. The thread was a loud voice to say the former.

The current system of Collected Issues hasn’t served customers well. If it had, the thread would likely never have started, still less been so well supported. You folks don’t deem it necessary to address anything though - you don’t tell us what is being worked on, or when. There’s been nothing to address the question of how increasing features are giving ever more issues, and no sign of any consolidation period where bigger flashy new features take a back seat to getting the basics sorted.

So unless something changes here, with better and more substantive communication with users and more flesh on the bones for addressing those hundreds - not 16 - of smaller but for many critical consolidation of existing features, I’m afraid this will continue to look like a PR exercise to many of us. I would LOVE you folks to prove us wrong.

Although I have little confidence Steinberg can change its overall product quality (not a cynic, just a realist), it’s too soon to conclude they did not listen. It would be fair to wait and see if they can iron out most standing and transferred issues at the end of version 8’s life cycle. That would be a Re|volution!

I’m not sure it is too soon, sadly Niles. The questionnaire represents their response to the original thread, and they said as much. There has been nothing else accompanying it, and nothing in any statement on the forum to suggest any other action except Business As Usual re bug fixes etc. It was unusual to get a response at all, and it certainly surprised me. So what they said is doubtless the sanctIoned and approved response. It would be very strange now to discover that they’re also doing more substantive things to address the concerns of the thread, but didn’t think to mention it to anyone.

To be clear - he questionnaire is a good and fine thing as far as it goes, and hopefully Cubase 9 might have responded a fraction more to customer demand than it would have done otherwise. But a revolution, with our without funky punctuation, seems most unlikely on current evidence.

Completely agree with Noiseboyuk.

It’s nice that Steinberg is asking us about what new features we would like to see implemented in the next version of Cubase. However, that was never the issue. The issue was always about fixing the current bugs FIRST, then adding new features later. With the responses I’ve seen from them so far, I’m HIGHLY skeptical this will ever be a priority for them unless people start talking with their wallets. Maybe then they will listen :slight_smile:.

Still it’s premature, we have to wait and judge when the time comes.

I’m not sure I agree.
Steinberg is certainly already not happy that there is a gazillion post thread on their forum suggesting that their software is FULL OF BUGS and they are doing nothing about it. I’m sure it does not engender confidence in any potential Cubase customers.

I, personally, do not think it is “full of bugs” relative to any Industry Standard.
I have my issues - mainly efficiency - but 2 new powerful boxes I just built will help that.
And Cubase - to me - has features I MUST have that no other DAW has.

Noiseboyuk’s original Thread, though a good “prod” to Steinberg IMHO, has given unfortunate voice to many who:

  • Have Hardware/Software issues and blame Steinberg
  • Are experiencing user error
  • Have a “Pet Bug” that drives them crazy but few others
  • etc, which may make the functionality of the software look much worse than it is (it’s quite good!) to non-users

Don’t get me wrong. There are legitimate issues that need to be addressed - as in almost ANY complex piece of Software.
But for Steinberg to come on here and say . . . “You’re right. Our product is a programming MESSS. FULL of BUGS! Didn’t think you’d mind!! So sorry. We’ll get right on it” . . .
. . . would be business suicide, I think. And untrue (the “full of bugs” part).

But . . . I believe they have heard the noise (understatement of the year).
And I believe they will act on it. Anything else would be poor judgement.

People should keep in mind that for these posters to spend so much time and energy here complaining . . . they must REALLY like Cubase. And they must REALLY like it more than they are annoyed by it.
Otherwise they’d be on a different forum complaining about a different DAW. :unamused:

Have Faith.

Hugh

Agree a lot with Hugh.

Also, i feel like most things in the survey are actually things that could be called “requested enhancements of existing features”. That’s not exactly bugfixes, but it is kinda in the same department: Trying to make things work as the user expects them to work. Accompanied by SB’s statement, that they are of course working on the regular bugfixes as well, i am pretty confident and happy. This is already more “direct involvement of the regular customer” than i can remember from Apple, Presonus or Ableton. I hope they keep going this direction more bravely.