Accidental Collision

Hello Daniel & Team,

I found a rather simple situation where Dorico will produce an accidental collision. Thankfully, this is just a sketch for an orchestral work, but who knows, I or someone else may need this configuration in a piano work someday. Just posting for for your knowledge, and the improvement of a great program!

I’ve attached a screenshot, and a 2 measure project that reproduces the problem. The project has default settings in everything.

Accidental (365 KB)

Screen Shot 2020-07-08 at 10.04.34 AM.png
How did you create the 3/4 measure? Sometimes when changing the meter - and I don’t know the ins/outs of this - spacing can get weird. I have attached your two chords, the first in 3/8, then in the meters you posted - both are correctly displayed. For the second one, I created a 4/4 measure, then added a measure and created the 3/4 meter. I’m sure someone will come along with a better explanation - and solution, but the meter thing is where I would start looking.

I did notice that without the 3/4, the collision didn’t occur. I didn’t do anything special to create the 3/4, just a simple popover. I’m pretty sure this is just a bug, without any user error. I also tried the chord out in another rhythmic position (beat 2), and had the same collision. Anyway, thanks for trying to shed some light on this!

Hmm…Did you create the chord, and then added the meter change, or the other way around. I shouldn’t matter ( I don’t think). Also - and again, I’m just firing in the dark - do you have Insert Mode on? Again, someone more knowledgeable (yes, the bar is low) will come along and sort it out.

This seems to be a pathological case for the algorithm for accidental stacking, which I’ll keep hold of, but realistically we’re unlikely to make any changes in this area imminently. These kinds of problems are vanishingly rare (I can only recall seeing one or two other examples in four years) and always extremely dense and dissonant chords. In this particular case the time signature is certainly not significant, but the presence of the back note with its own accidental plus an accidental for the adjacent front note plus another accidental at least an octave away from the adjacent front note needs to be present as well. I would certainly not rule out us trying t resolve this collision automatically in the future, but any change we might make to make this (very unlikely) situation better runs the risk of making other (much more likely) situations less optimal, so it’s always a tricky thing to balance.

In the meantime you should find that selecting the B4 notehead and then adjusting the X position of the accidental using the ‘Accidental X’ property in Engrave mode allows you to resolve the collision. I’m sorry for the inconvenience caused.

I can live with that, thanks Daniel.

It’s good to have an official answer to this, but I am curious: I was able to create the chords without the collisions. Why does it work for me, and not for the OP (I realize I’m not that special!).

You made a different chord :slight_smile:

Your two upper notes are a third lower than the two upper notes of the OP. If you raise them by a third you’ll get the accidental collission.


Well that just confirms why I am lousy proofreader! Thanks for that.