# Aleatoric boxes **URL:** \ **Category:** Dorico\ **Created:** [September 23, 2024, 8:19pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133 "2024-09-23T20:19:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![David\_Campo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@David\_Campo](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/David_Campo)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2024, 8:19pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/1 "2024-09-23T20:19:06Z")
Is there an easy and efficient way to make aleatoric boxes in Dorico Pro 5? I’ve tried many of the workarounds and I just can’t seem to make them work… ---
**Author:** ![RobinHoffmann](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/robinhoffmann/32/203240_2.png) [@RobinHoffmann](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/RobinHoffmann)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2024, 8:44pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/2 "2024-09-23T20:44:36Z")
Did you follow the steps explained in this video? They work pretty well for me: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/bGtwMG-tybM/maxresdefault.jpg "Creating Aleatoric Boxes in Dorico") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGtwMG-tybM) ---
**Author:** ![David\_Campo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@David\_Campo](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/David_Campo)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2024, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/3 "2024-09-24T13:29:12Z")
Robin, Thanks for that solution; it works pretty well! Is there a way I can adjust the height of the box as well as the width? ---
**Author:** ![David\_Campo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@David\_Campo](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/David_Campo)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2024, 1:30pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/4 "2024-09-24T13:30:26Z")
Robin, Sorry for the repeated questions, but do you put the box in first and then put the notes in or do you put the notes first and then enclose with the box? ---
**Author:** ![MicheleGalvagno](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/michelegalvagno/32/51337_2.png) [@MicheleGalvagno](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/MicheleGalvagno)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/5 "2024-10-29T18:18:52Z")
I’ve created the lines and they seem to work reasonably well. My only doubt is: if one needs smaller boxes just around a few noteheads, does one need to create multiple lines with shorter hooks to make it work? ---
**Author:** ![wing](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/wing/32/248876_2.png) [@wing](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/wing)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2024, 7:04pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/6 "2024-10-29T19:04:58Z")
I’ve personally tried the above video’s method but I have found it can be fairly inflexible to adjust and time-consuming to build. There’s also the free font [AleBoxes](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes-font/712764), which I think is more flexible, but yes, it’s another workaround. I believe the team is looking at a way to make this easier in a future update. _fingers crossed_ In the meantime I actually prefer somewhat of a hybrid, I simply create a special repeat bracket/brace around the notes I want, and I then use the big long center line as recommended in that video above. ---
**Author:** ![arnocello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19adc/32.png) [@arnocello](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/arnocello)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2024, 8:54pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/7 "2024-11-05T20:54:37Z")
Is it possible for the music inside of aleatoric boxes to spread out over more than one measure, and to hide the barline. Can Dorico do something like this excerpt from Corigliano’s first symphony? ![Screen Shot 2024-11-05 at 3.53.13 PM](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/original/4X/9/4/7/947c918cf77c89552f21cfed7d3bd3eeed63e067.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![dan\_kreider](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/dan_kreider/32/254871_2.png) [@dan\_kreider](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/dan_kreider)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2024, 9:06pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/8 "2024-11-05T21:06:42Z")
No, boxes presently require workarounds. And no, they can’t erase bar lines. ---
**Author:** ![arnocello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19adc/32.png) [@arnocello](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/arnocello)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2024, 9:10pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/9 "2024-11-05T21:10:53Z")
Thanks for the news. I’m already missing Finale’s Staff Styles! Hopefully in Dorico 6… ---
**Author:** ![meixner](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/meixner/32/137832_2.png) [@meixner](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/meixner)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2024, 11:28pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/10 "2024-11-05T23:28:09Z")
But you can insert an **open** meter **locally** in flute 1 at that spot and use an empty text frame with border to create the box in Engrave mode. ---
**Author:** ![arnocello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19adc/32.png) [@arnocello](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/arnocello)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2024, 1:19am UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/11 "2024-11-06T01:19:23Z")
Thank you. I tried it, and works, but the flute1 barline, when it appears before and after the box, is separated from the rest of the woodwind group. Is there any way to prevent fix that? ---
**Author:** ![meixner](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/meixner/32/137832_2.png) [@meixner](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/meixner)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2024, 8:18am UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/12 "2024-11-06T08:18:48Z")
Yes, I see … I tried, but the usual ways of reconnecting barlines seem not to work in this case, not sure why though - can some of the wise clarify? ---
**Author:** ![johnkprice](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/johnkprice/32/119850_2.png) [@johnkprice](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/johnkprice)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2024, 10:24am UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/13 "2024-11-06T10:24:11Z")
Is this close enough? ![Image](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/original/4X/f/1/e/f1e6b9bbd4763f6a139ecfff6367318f3a1f3cb6.png) I gave the first flute and clarinet staves local 4/4 time signatures and gave the barlines inside the boxes local tick barlines with the **Tick adj.** property set to -1/2 for **Out** and **In** in engrave mode. ---
**Author:** ![meixner](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/meixner/32/137832_2.png) [@meixner](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/meixner)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2024, 10:46am UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/14 "2024-11-06T10:46:05Z")
Ah … praise to the Master @johnkprice , again! Thanks! He is the guy to learn from … ---
**Author:** ![arnocello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19adc/32.png) [@arnocello](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/arnocello)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2024, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/15 "2024-11-06T21:40:05Z")
Thank you Mr. Price! I can’t wait to try it. ---
**Author:** ![marilazar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7cd45c/32.png) [@marilazar](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/marilazar)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2025, 4:50pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/16 "2025-03-11T16:50:01Z")
This seems very nice @johnkprice and very close to what I need, but to be honest, I cannot see how to do such a box. I need this for piano 2 staves… ---
**Author:** ![johnkprice](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/johnkprice/32/119850_2.png) [@johnkprice](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/johnkprice)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2025, 6:13pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/17 "2025-03-11T18:13:38Z")
My post was about hiding barlines inside aleatoric boxes. If you want to know how to create such boxes, see the video in post #2 of this topic. ---
**Author:** ![marilazar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7cd45c/32.png) [@marilazar](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/marilazar)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2025, 8:21pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/18 "2025-03-11T20:21:26Z")
I’ve just fixed it, thanks to @RobinHoffmann! ---
**Author:** ![andrea.larose](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/andrea.larose/32/329658_2.png) [@andrea.larose](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/andrea.larose)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2025, 7:04pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/19 "2025-10-20T19:04:18Z")
So, here we are with Dorico 6.1. Has this become native or is it still a workaround? ---
**Author:** ![MarcLarcher](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/steinberg/user_avatar/forums.steinberg.net/marclarcher/32/1623_2.png) [@MarcLarcher](https://forums.steinberg.net/u/MarcLarcher)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2025, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133/20 "2025-10-20T19:07:03Z")
Still a workaround. But now you have cut-away scores. Getting closer 😉 [Next page](https://forums.steinberg.net/t/aleatoric-boxes/938133.md?page=2)