Are you ready for 10.5 ?

Fair enough. Recently finished Michel de Montaigne’s “Complete Essays” so I am a bit rusty. As is the “Keep My Mac Automatically Up to Date” algorithm. Clearly it missed that announcement.

The rest of my business needs are expected to wait for Steinberg to catch up? Didn’t Yamaha have the developer’s release all summer like everyone else? One wonders how they were able to work on anything.

Nevermind. Everything else on my system is working just fine. Like, 99% of it.

Just not Cubase. Or the UR824.

:unamused:

There’s so many audio products where the advice is to not upgrade, agree that they should’ve been ready tho- Apple provide plenty of previews to test your apps. Concerning the number of plugins I own and the manufacturers who have issued “don’t upgrade” warnings it’s a bit of a poor show really on all their behalf’s.

I am still on High SIerra. It works fine. The apps works fine. Dont see a reason to upgrade yet.

Someone mentioned of a Padshop Pro 2 to be released.
Perhaps with Cubase 10.5?

Padshop Pro 1 IIRC was released years ago as a paid X.5 release.

Same here. Everything works just fine on my Windows 7 boxes. I have no desire to move them to Windows 10 and go through all the fun of random things breaking. Cubase 10 is sufficient for my needs, so I think I’ll just save the money.

I hear you. But you probably want to start backing up and making sure you have all your stuff ready for a migration sometime next year. The end of life (meaning end of security patches as well I think), is in a few months. As long as your systems aren’t connected to the Internet, it doesn’t really matter, but either way, you can’t continue to run it forever as it’s a legacy system – so with be on par to doing work on a Windows NT or 2000 system. You really REALLY need to have a very good business case to depend on working on one of those systems. The longer you keep running them and the longer you keep putting work and data on them, the more painful the move might be when you do ultimately have to migrate.

Windows 10 is what is it. As long as you turn off all the extra fancy junk that is running in the background, if will behave and look like Win 7. There are performance benefits that take advantage of speed and performance of newer modern hardware that are built into the OS application.

Hidpi in win10 needs to be fixed before 10.5. 10.0.x has been useless for me due to this issue. If it is fixed only for 10.5, the update should be free. I have not used Cubase at all after purchasing it.

The trouble with that is if the fix requires Win 10 (Which i’ve read on here in the past), in which point do Steinberg really want to make the final release of C10 to be Win 10 only?

C10.5 may have a new look interface for all we know, the switch to Win 10 will open up more possibilities to them in regards to displays and it may go more the Dorico direction using vector based graphics.

I’ve been a professional software developer using Microsoft technologies for 30 years, so I’m pretty familiar with how all this works. End of life doesn’t mean your system stops working. It just means MS is no longer issuing updates for it. And I’ve had automatic updates disabled on every system I have for decades. Each time you patch the OS (or any other software), there’s an equal chance that you introduce new, random problems. I update when there’s a need. If it works, I don’t fix it. And Windows 7 works just fine.

And no, I don’t need a good business case to continue using what works. A good business case is only needed to change to something new. As there isn’t one for me at the moment, my system will remain as it is.

…excluding exploits that won’t be fixed, cloud services* that stop working and antivirus becoming less effective on that system of course. It really depends what you qualify as ‘works’. Technically the Titanic was still afloat when it hit the iceberg.

I personally wouldn’t be doing my job if i was sending files to colleagues using out-dated OS, or would i be comfortable having my only backups held locally. In my opinion, Someone who knows their computing really should be more pro-active and less reactive - or you’ll find yourself forced into an upgrade at a time that may not suit you, which is a killer on a professional level - i avoid that scenario at all costs.

You can do what you want with your systems. I am a profession Infrastructure engineer and I can tell you from experience, the longer you keep putting valuable data and information into legacy systems (any type of data where you invested your time an effort into making is has value!) the more painful will be your experience extracting it into a new system when that system dies, and that system will die at some point. One of the reasons part of my job is still to support and maintain old IBM, Sun OS and IRIX rubbish junk yard systems in addition to newer hardware and OSs is that certain people want to keep the old legacy systems running because they are too afraid to, and have no time to figure out how to move those applications to a newer platform.

I have just upgraded from Windows 8.1 to 10 and have had very few issues and those were the elicenser and a few plugins that needed re-registering and it has been working fine. I feel that I have been quite lucky. I’m touching wood as I say that.

The problem with running on an older system is that most of the software that you will buy currently will have been tested or developed on Windows 10 which is by default the optimum system. Again this is fine if you don’t plan to upgrade anything. However as soon as you do there is always the chance that something might be introduce to create instability.

This really depends if you use your computer as a computer with among other things, a DAW, or a music creating device, with no internet connection and no updates unless needed (and checked on another computer for viruses). Yes I know the latter one is getting more difficult with online installers and licences, but it is still good practice, to have an “as is” system, not a continuously updating one.
An update gone wrong can cost you a day of work (or fun) easily…

Exactly the same position as you, and the biggest concern is slowly people fall out of these businesses who know the tricks to the legacy software - the same will happen at any software development company too. I’m lucky in that i’ve built up a wealth of knowledge so can serve my customers and they can sit on older platforms because of that. BUT at the same time, while i use and code to newer systems i’m probably not making use of the newer methods that someone younger/fresher guys would - so it’s a catch 22 situation. Companies the size of Steinberg need to be bringing new talents to their software to progress is, not ‘jack of all trades’ like me.

Look at Logic on the Mac,the EXS24 sampler is aging bad and they have no-one who knows how to bring it up to date, Cubase also lost a lot of talent when the guys went on to create Studio One - if you allow things to stagnate and stretch yourself into supporting old systems the problem is that no new talent will be trained in it’s use OR concepts, you can get yourself cornered real quick if you fall into that pit. Recruitment becomes a nightmare.

In my experience/opinion, If you’re using it professionally you should be archiving/backing up projects externally, you should also ensure that you’re taking responsibility to protect all assets from exploits, and protecting your clients. If you’re manually taking backups to external drives and ONLY mounting them as read only on a host machine which does such tasks then you’re wasting way more than a day per month with such manual processes - tracking that is a challenge in itself.

Anything else, such as networking off/online machines or exchanging data via external drives in both directions then you’re open for far more issues than what a windows update brings (Which is fully protected with image backups anyway) - so it makes the ‘offline’ concept negated and borderline neanderthal, particularly when so much in the audio world authenticates/installs online.

Takes me 30 mins to come back from a complete system failure via disk image, i’ve had it occur twice in the past 5 years - funny enough both times was on Mac, Windows 10… as of yet, not needed such measures, but i’ve ran two complete restores on Win 10 as a test and it went very smooth, one was a move from HDD to SDD too. I really don’t know how it would take a day to recover, plus being up to date you haven’t got to seek out legacy installers to restore a system that does fail from backup - just grab the latest.

If and when any of those things become an issue in my environment, I’ll take the necessary action. Since none of my servers or workstations appear to be taking on water, I’m comfortable listing their status as Working.

Eventually I’ll have to move to Windows 10. In fact, my keyboard workstation was a fresh install so I set it up for 10. And eventually, I’ll have to bite the bullet and reinstall my 7 boxes for 10. That will happen when they need to do something that 7 won’t do. And with respect, if you think upgrading to the Next New Thing just because it’s there is the definition of proactive, you haven’t lived through enough upgrade adventures or side effects that randomly appear and disrupt your work when you have the least time to deal with them. Productivity is about getting it done. My environment gets it done. When that’s no longer the case, I’ll do whatever is required, and at a point where I can survive the down time if things go sideways. Not, you know, like that ever happens with a software or OS update. :slight_smile:

Yep. There are lots and lots of applications in the real world that still run on legacy systems. And as you mentioned, having the time to port them to something new is a major factor in the business world, particularly when the legacy systems are getting the job done just fine. The people in charge of the purse strings often don’t see a benefit to spending money on rewriting an entire application, with all the new bugs that can introduce, to do the exact same thing the legacy system already does. And the legacy system has had years of operation to flush out the bugs. New development is, by definition, unproven.

Typically, the people most interested in porting things so they can do the exact same thing, only in a newer technology, are people who want to play with the new technology. Or update their resumes. Neither of those makes for an impressive business case to upper management. So, the minis and mainframes you work with live on, and continue to get the job done, while new money is spent on new functionality that doesn’t already exist.

Many professional studios run much older versions of Pro Tools instead of the latest and greatest for just this reason. Plus, a) spending money on new hardware to do the same thing the old hardware did and b) heaven only knows what ripple effects you have to deal with once you’ve done the upgrade. So, many continue to use an older system that’s proven itself to be stable and reliable.

That used to be true in a few cases, but everything we do now is subject to external auditing from a certification viewpoint and client requirement. I don’t know if it’s to create jobs and keep businesses buying into tech, but if we sat on Win 7 none of us would have jobs, so it’s not a choice - rather than compliance in a world where business security is paramount to competing and engaging in the modern world.

Despite this, when i speak to friends in the City i consider what we have to put up with as childs play - as you’re right, in larger organisations it’s hipster-like to absorb the latest tech/frameworks for no logical reason than being ‘new’. BUT, that said, these people are the future of app development, so things have to move forward and as users not being in sync will have consequences when you’re having to play catch up at a time that’s not suitable for you personally.

Me personally, i find upgrades so much easier nowadays, everything sits on a framework so as long as the core functions of that framework have ported ok, the app that sits on top (presuming it’s been coded to conformities) then no problems, i’ve not had any upgrade issues for years and years.

An excellent point to consider, to be sure. I’m certainly not suggesting that we should all be running our operations on a dusty old Amiga in the back closet (although that might be entertaining).

However, software developers don’t work for free, and development of any nontrivial system costs lots of money. That’s why many companies take a wait and see approach. When they see trouble on the horizon, they begin to allocate funds and take action. In the meantime, if the system is getting it done, they spend money on something else.

While keeping my boxes in 7 isn’t a financial decision, much of the motivation is the same. Upgrades can easily go sideways, and very often have unforeseen ripple effects that may not show up until days or weeks later, when you don’t have the time to screw with it. I’m no stranger to fighting those battles, but I don’t do so just so I can be using what the cool kids are using. I enter that fight when necessity dictates. Personally, I see that as the benefit of experience.