Audio Track

Guitar Pro 8 allows notation and an audio track. It’s very handy for arranging songs that need part scores for members of a band. Good when you have an audio demo or track and you want to do notation for an accompaniment.

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Indeed. Will go for this before current sale (£21.00 upgrade from v7) ends. That audio track looks really fun in use on some videos I’ve seen.!

Won’t get so bothered about its MusicXML output showing issues upon import to Dorico. Am only running Elements (limited engraving), so can’t be too fussy…

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I can visualize implementing VSTlink in Dorico, and shipping Dorico with Cubase LE (optional download) at no extra charge.

There’s a minor inconvenience of having to load the tracking stuff independently in another app as a second step. Perhaps Dorico could have a line in the project file somewhere that simply checks for, and launches an associated Cubase/Nuendo project automatically with the proper command line to auto load the associated Cubase project. There’s also a matter of learning curve (More is possible in LE than a simple stereo audio track; hence a little investment in learning to use it).

I don’t know if it’s practical or desired to do such a thing among the Dorico dev and marketing people, but it seems to me like it ‘might’ be possible to implement it in a way that’s quite seamless from a user perspective. It also sets up a potentially interesting tracking DAW doorway/experience (which might, or might not be desired depending upon who one asks) for new users.

Question for me is…which is less trouble from a dev perspective? Getting bi-directional VSTlink working, or adding a proper audio track? (Or native MTC. VSTLink being preferred in this case, since it can share the audio stream as well without extra third party software hoops…while MTC is more universally implemented in all brands of DAWs)

If I could have native/working VSTLink and a free option for LE (for students and other clients who don’t want/need a full featured tracking DAW) ‘sooner’ than a proper audio track from a dev/release perspective…personally, I’d rather have that ASAP…and wait a bit longer for the proper audio track.

Regardless of my ‘questions’, it’s likely this ‘audio track’ stuff is already being discussed and on a road-map somewhere. So it’s…wait and see…

As a side-note…if there is some cut down version of WaveLab that could be synced and bundled for free…some users might prefer that to Cubase LE.

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This is an interesting thought. The challenge to implementing it, as I see it, is arranging for Dorico and any version of Cubase to share the Audio Engine for simultaneous linked playback. It’s not an insurmountable problem, I expect, but not a small one.

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I’m making a LOT of guesses and assumptions here but it’s fun to play ‘what if’.

What if, the base audio engine already has the bulk of the work done (for VSTLink support)? I don’t know what all was borrowed from Cubendo world, and what all they had to start from scratch.

If the Dev Team is lucky, VSTLink support already exists at the base engine level. The issue then becomes, how to best present it to the user and give him controls to activate and use it (and it’s not an easy thing to sort out by any means).

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I’ve been lately doing some work with Dorico and logic synced via TXL Timecode. I’m quite happy with the workflow, the only thing I wish for is that dorico (and for example cubase) could share the same tempo track and bar structure automatically.

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The whole new audio tracks inside Dorico would be better.

Very often, people mixing traditional instruments and ‘tape’ have very sophisticate notation needs. Cubase can’t go into that territory.

Paolo

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If there is any luck flying around, I think it left VSTLink way out of the picture, some long, long time ago… :smile:

Seriously though, this was a very clever piece of technology SB developed. Sadly it didn’t quite get the attention (from the community or internally) that perhaps it deserved/promised and never really took hold. Although, it is still there and available in Cubendo today.!

Yes, some nice thoughts there @Brian_Roland; though having seen how Guitar Pro recently added Audio Track capabilities into its version 8 release, I have to say something similar would be a great way forward for the Dorico team to follow.

I get you’re (bravely) trying to see if any ‘heavy-lifting’ dev time involved in such an addition could be lessened as a ‘short term’ option - and agreed it is fun to play the ‘what if’ game now and again… :smile:

Anyway, you know it, we all know it - the team is fantastic at what they’ve achieved and delivered so far and will of course continue to do so. The flexibility/convenience/fun of having a bespoke Audio Track ‘tool/facility’ from them built-in will, I believe, be massively more appealing in the long run for everyone.

I’d certainly think this is a nearer proposition than say, full Dorico ‘integration’ inside Cubendo.

Consider me another :slight_smile:

Yeah, I’ve been tinkering with VST System Link a bit. Pretty cool tech. While it was designed to hook up different computers and run them in sync, I’ve had interesting results running multiple hosts (Cubase 11 and 12 at the same time out of curiosity to see if it’d sync hosts on the same machine. I was using ASIO Link Pro to loop-back the relevant signals as opposed to a hard loop-back cable on a digital I/O. It works!).

I also realize that thanks to TXL, we can get some rudimentary sync signal already (and I had it before using some old black boxes and a smpte stripe in the video player). So…we aren’t in the dark if we need to track a little audio.

Personally, I’ve been syncing audio with Dorico since version 1 (using Bidule, with the asio sample count serving as very precise triggers to start audio files playing). So what comes in the future is pure gravy for me :slight_smile:

I agree that there are loads of ways to look at things, and different users prefer different things. The Dorico team has the data, and they generally know what’s best for the majority of their users.

I’m mostly impressed with Dorico…top to bottom. I’m increasingly ‘depressed’ when I have to work in those ‘other’ scoring suites.

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Currently, Nuendo does not beautifully and correctly show the musicXML file exported by Dorico.

It would be great if we could put an audio file or audio files in an exact position in a specific bar (nthBars:nthBeat:nth16thNote:nth120thsOfA16thNote), precisely as we put a note or notes in an exact position in a particular bar.
Moreover, it would be fantastic if

  1. Dorico could graphically show the amplitude contour (envelope) and spectral information (spectrogram) of the inserted audio file;
  2. the length of the audio file could be reflected on the score related to the notated rhythmic value on the score.
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I agree, that adding an audio track to Dorico would be a great feature for people who make transcriptions. There are only two things that keeps me away from switching completely from finale to dorico: audio track and ability to record tempo changes.
When I make a transcription which is not in a locked tempo, I need to record tempo changes, by playing the pulse, along with the audio track.
Then my score is in sync with the audio and I can detect any differences between the audio and score very quickly and repeat only those bars that need to be transcribed or corrected.
That allows very fast workflow.
I would be very gratefull I you could add these features.
Thank you.

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Since Dorico knows the Timecode to any note, I think it should also be able to input an audio track at a specific Timecode (similar to video). Then, a switch might be helpful: link to Timecode or link to a specific relative beat (as described by you). It needs to be interchangeable.

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Yes, I agree.
However, I think that “audio track” should be designed similar to regular musical staves (in Dorico as a player) so that we could add audio files at specific positions in certain bars.

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What I suggested is very important as the feature of the notator.

Currently, we should add screenshots of waveform or spectral plots; otherwise, we should draw pictures describing the sound’s characteristics using graphics or symbols. Unfortunately, it is very time-consuming work.

It would be handy if there were a notator which shows the waveform and spectrograph contour by adding audio files into the audio tracks, which work just as musical staves.

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Indeed that would be great for pieces with instruments + fixed media

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As a provisory solution, we could convert audio files into a video file with a black screen because Dorico can import video files.

For example, I wrote a draft of the piano part for piano and electro-acoustic (fixed media) in Dorico, then exported an audio file of the flow. I arranged some audio files in Nuendo and then exported the draft of that Nuendo project as a video file.
Again in Dorico, I can work further with the electro-acoustic part while listening to from inserted video file. Of course, it is not the best condition to work, but not bad because the audio part added using Nuendo and the composed part using Dorico are perfectly synchronised.

If the waveform and spectograph would adjust to note spacing, that would be a very powerful tool! But quite challenging to implement as well, I would imagine.

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