Auto-Tagging in Cubase Media Bay (Key, Tempo, Category)

I don’t precisely know, but I think the internal ones are Steinberg proprietary ones.

Here is where I’m basing it on. (I’ve only got a super limited understanding of this)

But what is your exact question, @Kearley? If you have one, you should probably start a new post. That old topic is not really what you need.

@Kearley - I actually spend a good 500 hours with tagging my files in Media Bay before coming across Sononym (around 500.000 files). The app will not replace MediaBay for me. As I still need tempo matching aso. But it does a hell of a good job deep searching and finding samples that you would have never dug up through MediaBay through classic tags. One very cool feature is matching samples. If you have one sample you like, you can match it and it will go through all your samples and uses a complex set of algorithms to take a deep look at the actual files to match them up. Again, its not looking at database tags or meta, it is actually analyzing the files and matching it that way. So if you have older samples with no tags, it can still dig some useful material up for your projects that with classic sample librarians would have remained dusty mummies buried underneath tons of sand (; That is what I use it for. Once you have some good search results, you can then just drag into Cubase. I would much prefer that Media Bay would start utilizing AI to do that kind of file matching, analyzing and tagging automatically and natively in Cubase / Nuendo. Dull repetitive tasks are perfectly solved by AI. Should arch-rival Presonus Studio start adopting AI, Steinberg will eventually do it as well I suppose. No idea if there are any concrete plans to give Media Bay a brain. But it does need one badly.

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@stamb: I used a combo of three apps that all had their strengths and weekness for achieving one thing: Bulk tagging naked samples (in the sense of samples having no filename info or tags). I used a program called “Mixed in Key” to auto determine tempo and root key of my samples that had no tags or filename info. Weekness: It can only write the info into filenames for wavs (as mp3 tag functionality does not work for WAV and Mixed in Key does not support writing tags into BWF chunk headers). Converting all files to AIFF (which is also a lossless format but does support tags) would have meant converting 500.000 files from WAV to AIFF. So I stayed natively within WAV, wrote BPM and Root-Key info into filename. I then used a program called “Bulk Rename Utility” in combination with RegEx (regular expressions) to rename my audio files to a certain pre-defined scheme that would help me quickly bulk search & tag files in Media Bay according to certain search criteria in the filename such as A or Db or Dmin or 140bpm aso. Looking at the actual file sizes I was able to separate one shots from loops in bulk as well. Over the years, I build a booklet of about 10 pages of RegEx phrases for achieving various tasks related to preparing files for later bulk tagging in Media Bay. Building a well tagged sample library was a lot of work, but it really paid of, as I can now really get projects rolling quickly. But with AI, those 500 hours invested could have been achieved in something like a day or two max (my guess). Also, there is an inverse relationship between sample library size and efficiency. The more you have and more options you have, the harder it can get to find things. AI can also solve that issue very easily, and with Sononym, I now have a fourth app in my toolbox which helps me match sound & samples in a very deep manner quickly.

@avviano will you share the regex?

I’ve used keyfinder to key tag my files, which add a string to the filename. I just wrote a little script (in php) which scan my samples dirs to find the files. Used regex to find bpm and the key on these files. I update the mediabay3.db with sqlite with the founded bpm/key info. It is not fast, but working.

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@avviano Very cool.

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I have that to make kits for my 1010 bitbox mk2, hope steinberg buy sononym. Mediabay with sononym funktions badass stuff:)

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Totally agree. We need one Audio File Librarian that can do all tasks.

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I bet we are all willing to pay at least 100euro as a mediabay expansion just like SpectraLayers and SpectraLayers pro. then it will be mediabay and mediabay pro. it is something you really have to do, please get in touch with https://www.sononym.net/ steinberg they are just a few who work with this and things take time for them to reach their goal. they even worked to get cubase mediabay integration tags ect. they need your capital and knowledge. and mediabay will be sick good and smooth, when you have large libraries with extremely many samples and want to create kits quickly for hardware and get the whole drum bus kit in tune immediately. When you have recorded several hours of material and cut everything out in sample bits, I always use sononym to categorize in pitch and sound type.

this is a must on the cubase roadmap within a year :slight_smile: so you do not have to switch between the programs. have to say that I have tried to do it in mediabay which is a disaster and the font is old. mediabay does not even have a sample track built in to do all the work there of cutting stems into sample bits and putting them in a newly created folder “samples” sononym has this :)[quote=“Theswed, post:31, topic:134374, full:true”]
I bet we are all willing to pay at least 100euro as a mediabay expansion just like SpectraLayers and SpectraLayers pro. then it will be mediabay and mediabay pro. it is something you really have to do, please get in touch with https://www.sononym.net/ steinberg they are just a few who work with this and things take time for them to reach their goal. they even worked to get cubase mediabay integration tags ect. they need your capital and knowledge. and mediabay will be sick good and smooth, when you have large libraries with extremely many samples and want to create kits quickly for hardware and get the whole drum bus kit in tune immediately. When you have recorded several hours of material and cut everything out in sample bits, I always use sononym to categorize in pitch and sound type.

this is a must on the cubase roadmap within a year :slight_smile: so you do not have to switch between the programs. have to say that I have tried to do it in mediabay which is a disaster and the font is old. mediabay does not even have a sample track built in to do all the work there of cutting stems into sample bits and putting them in a newly created folder “samples” sononym has this :slight_smile:
[/quote]

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Well, Well, Well…

Looks like Waves has now set the standard with CR8 and COSMOS.
Sononym is a good 2nd, the best when it comes to finding similar samples.
And XLN-XO is still awesome when it comes to drum shots.
I particularly sometimes like to run Sononym on the side for when I want to look up similar sounds.

But for drums, XO is the fastest for me, and COSMOS + CR8 is the fastest for melodic one-shots.
Reaper on the only hand, just now added pitch detection to its Media Explorer, and a simple keystroke can toss samples onto new tracks and in the native sampler already key mapped.

It’s time for the DAWs to take the sampling side of music seriously. One shots and audio to midi (as playable instruments) ala Samplab are becoming major parts of electronic music production.

And I am keeping my eyes and wallet open for all who are paving the way.

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The algorithm for recognizing and categorizing samples in Waves Cosmos (free sample librarian) is very very impressive! Probably the best I’ve seen so far. At least I haven’t found a mismatch yet. It’s a very good beginning.

Thanks for pointing it out!

CR8 is also very interesting.

I dont understand cubase have Mediabay looooong time now, and no auto pitch Finder and a knob to tune and fine tune direct in media bay. And save it in project files or another sample folder. steinberg have everything they need to make it the best tag pitch on all sounds Finder. or at least collaborate with type sononym for organization and tag m.m. and COSMOS + CR8 with XLN-XO ect. same here I use sononym for organization and to find similar sounds quickly. but the problem with sononym is that if you do not have a referee’s bank of sound then it can be completely artificial, and have sononym difficult for different FX and bongo and congas, rather different hihats. I sent to steinberg that I want it all my samples I bought from steinberg as cubase 12 absolute 5 m.m in wav format so you can have it as a reference bank in sononym. my isotope pligins have everything in wav that you can also have as a reference. when I want to run a eurorack session and want to find sound that I myself created with long sessions with hardware.
I want to press the sample on the audio track, then it should automatically show pitch with pitch offset and 2 knobs to adjust quickly and easily, as there are very small adjustments for drum, percussion to get sweetspot sometimes. the same goes for synths, this feature should also be included in the channel strip before pre gain. cubase 12 has everything to add this feature coz the feature already exists all over the place in cubase. but not in a way so it does work quickly with audio files.

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