Bar number oddity

I have a situation where I need to put a system break for every line of lyrics. (See attached file). This means splitting bars and putting a partial bar at the start of the next line. (I’m using the meter popover to specify incomplete values, eg. “4/4,3” then “4/4,1” then using Shift-S in engrave mode to move the 1-beat measure to the next system). When I do that, the bar with the 3 beats in it is displayed in the System Track with the same bar number as the bar before it. (What was bar 2 before being split is now bar one). The bar with the one beat in it also now shows as bar 1 in the system track. This behavior happens throughout the piece.

This doesn’t seem right. Is this the expected behavior?

Also, I have specified in Layout options to display bar numbers on every bar. If I make any bar number changes, the bar numbers are no longer displayed on those bars. If I go to the edit menu and Reset Appearance the bar numbers are still not displayed. How does one remove all bar number changes if not that way?

In XML export, pickup bars at the beginning in other projects I’ve experimented with are labeled as bar 1 even though they are displayed as bar zero in the score. At measure 7 in the attached file, the split portion is displayed as [7] to, I assume, indicate it is part of the previous measure so far as counting goes. In XML it is labeled as measure 11! Shouldn’t pickup measures be labeled zero and partial measures with an X prefix (eg. X8, X9, …)?

I wish shift-S in engrave mode in the middle of a measure would result in the creation of two separate measures (no bar line on the first), the 2nd of which is not counted as a measure in XML output or on-screen.
Dorico5-1 bar number issues.dorico (876.9 KB)

You can insert a system break at any position in a bar. On the Note input and editing page of Preferences, deactivate Snap system and frame breaks to barlines when creating. Thereafter when you create a system or frame break, it will be made at the selected position.

Perhaps you’re aware of this and you’re asking that creating a system break in the middle of the bar should in fact not create a system break (or at least, not only create a system break) and additionally split the bar in two. I don’t think that’s something we’re likely to implement, if so.

The bar number behaviour you describe in Dorico itself with irregular bars is what I would expect. Dorico will be interpreting the single quarter irregular bar as a pick-up bar, which means it will end up with the same displayed bar number as the previous bar.

We haven’t worked on handling the difference between displayed bar numbers and “actual” bars in MusicXML export as yet, so that kind of discrepancy doesn’t surprise me. We’ll try to take a look at this aspect of MusicXML export before too long.

I know about the system break at any position. My final product has to have the split as two different measures, the 2nd one not counted as an “actual” bar.

The bar number problem is that the first measure of the split bar is taking on the bar number of the previous (non-split) measure. See my attached file. I split measure 2 into 2 parts. When doing so, measure 2 is now labeled as measure 1! I now have 3 bars labeled measure 1. That doesn’t seem normal.

Also, what happened to the bar number at the start of measure 2? It is the first part of the now split measure and should show a bar number. How do I reset bar number changes so that everything is at the default bar number settings? (Reset appearance doesn’t do it).

If the xml music export made a difference between displayed and actual bar numbers (and the discrepancy in bar numbering above) I could do all of the work I need to do in Dorico and not have to fall back to MuseScore for the xml file the client needs.

Hi @JAMES_GILBERT , I tried a different approach for you particular case (I attach a possible solution).
I used, for every bar that needed, a real meter change (not the “upbeat” option with incomplete meters), than I have hidden all of them. I made so the first three pages and it seems to solves your issues (you have the lines at the end of each staff, and the bar numbering is consistent). In Page 4 you can see the added meters (before hiding them).
(don’t know about the XML part of your request).
I hope I didn’t misinterpret your needs.

Dorico5-1 bar number issues POSSIBLE SOLUTION.dorico (878.0 KB)

Thanks for the help. I’m going to have to study it a bit to fully grasp it. Instead of doing measure 2 as 4/4 with 3 beats then a 4/4 measure with 1 beat you specified it as a 3/4 measure and a separate 1/4 measure. I assume you highlighted the time sig and pressed delete? Whenever I hide the time signature I get a signpost but I see that deleting it doesn’t result in a signpost. This method will save some time. I had the barline blank (a modified dashed barline) at the end of the first system (and others) on purpose. Even though what is shown in Dorico has the correct measure numbers, the exported XML numbers every measure, even the 1/4 measures as a separate number. What is the start of the 2nd system becomes measure 3 instead of being ignored so far as the counting goes. I’m still not sure why the measure number disappeared and/or was given the wrong number. The lack of a way to remove lyric extensions and the xml exporting not ignoring incomplete measures means I’ll end up doing the finishing touches in MuseScore. Oh well. Thanks for the ideas.