Bizarre page formatting problems

Dorico
1

Hello,

I am coming to Dorico from Finale. Most things I have been able to change, but there are five things (four that are particularly problematic for distributing the parts) that I cannot figure out, but which were a breeze in Finale. I have the file available if someone would like it to see it, but, as you will see, part of the issue is that the file will not display the copyright.

Problems:
(1) I cannot get the “Copyright” information to display on page 1. I have tried changing the colors, and nothing changes.
(2) On subsequent pages, I tried to simply have page numbers as footers (not headers), and on the left for left pages and the right for right pages. This has seemed to work, but then after a certain number of pages, Dorico stops following my requests.
(3) Similar to no. 2, I want the title to display on the left and right footers, and so far, nothing has seemed to convince Dorico to display these correctly, even with trying to create my own Page Layout and also modifying the Default. Nothing is consistently working. This was a breeze with the “Page Layout Tool” in Finale.
(4) Most disturbingly, Dorico duplicated pages 1-11 of my document, so if I am to print it, the pianist (who reads from the score) gets a duplication of the first 11 pages. I cannot find out how to explain to Dorico that this is “wrong.” (Not that I would have guessed Dorico would get this wrong.)
(5) Not as important, but still important for me to eventually resolve, is being able to stretch tempo marks or the like over two lines, viz.

   G. P.

(in tempo)

Right now, I can only have everything on one line, which can be an issue for formatting. (Again, this was a breeze in Finale.)

Anybody able to help me, particularly with items 1-4? These are going to make giving the parts to players virtually impossible (and also problematic as far as displaying the copyright info; I am not sure why Dorico is doing this to me).

Sincerely,

Ian Guthrie

2

Are you trying to make changes to Page Templates after you have created page overrides (red triangles on the pages panel)? If so, remove the overrides.

Does the copyright now show?

if not…

Is there a copyright token on your First Page Template, and is the text frame large enough to display the information?
Is the information included on your Project Information?

Sounds like you have created two music Frame chains.

3

Hello Janus,

Some of the pages do have the over-rides. I do not know how to reset the overrides. Even so, I am not able to get it to appear, even when I make the boxes bigger.

For the other pages, I have no idea what this two music Frame chains even means. I can get Finale, LibreOffice, Word, etc. to display left and right pages as footers in no time. What is the trick to do this instantaneously in Dorico?

Would attaching the file help?

4

Make sure you haven’t got page overrides on those pages, too. Manual changes to the page frames will prevent any changes to the templates being applied.

In general, make sure you’re applying these edits to page numbers on the Page Template. Add ‘tokens’ to the page frame on the templates (much like Finale’s “fields”) and then populate the Project Info.

For the Tempo Marks, I’d suggest using System Text for this. In the case of your example, there’s no actual tempo change. If there is, you can apply it as a hidden tempo mark, e.g. (q=110) in the popover.

Yes, this would be a massive help in finding out what you’ve done – and what you should have done instead! :smiley:

5

Alright, file is attached!

I am at working right now, so I only have Dorico SE here. (Thus, I have no access to the Engrave option.) I did experiment with the Copyright information, though, and it does appear Dorico is showing that when the page has no overrides.

Subterranean Tunnels (3rd draft).dorico (2.2 MB)
Here is the file, though!

6

OK, you’ve made so many manual changes to the page layout, as shown by the red triangles (manual “overrides” to the page frames on that page) and green borders (Manual changes to which template is applied on that page.)

Screenshot
Screenshot404×644 8.59 KB

Everything goes back to normal by page 12, and there are no manual changes from then on.

Your “Title and Page numbers on bottom” template uses “ML” on one frame and “MM” on the other. You’ll see this in the top left corner of the frame when you’re editing frames. I suspect this is from adding and deleting music frames while you were designing.
Normally, the Music frame should say “MA”.

Screenshot
Screenshot614×790 17.5 KB

Basically, M is for Master (you’re on a Master, i.e. template page), and A is the first frame chain. Music will flow from frame to frame in the same chain. So every thing wants to be A! If you create another chain, then you will get the same music again, separately.

Realistically, you just wanted to customize the “default” template, which would automatically apply to pages 2 onwards. For now, I’ve removed all the manual adjustments, and applied your template to page 2 onwards. (With the frames set to “MA”.)

You’ve made your edits to page 1 “on the page”, rather than on the “First” template – that’s OK, if you don’t plan on using this layout for other documents, (or layouts in the same document).

Your Copyright text frame does have the Project Copyright token in it:

Screenshot 13
Screenshot 13864×214 22.7 KB

But there’s no text in File > Project Info > Copyright. I’ve added some.

Screenshot

I changed Paragraph Style of the Copyright token back to “Copyright”, as you’d made some manual changes (white background).

Your first page is a little crowded – the first system is too full to display the dynamics aligned. You could possibly go down a smidge on the staff size, for a better use of the page. I leave that to you !!

Here’s the revised file. Hope this helps!

Subterranean Tunnels (revision).dorico (1.5 MB)

2 Likes
7

@benwiggy, that is awesome! I appreciate your time, effort, and clarity! I feel like you have both caught me a fish but also have taught me to fish!

As far as the cluttered first page, etc.: Yes, I definitely need to clean it up. However, I thought the page formatting would be a breeze (clearly I was wrong), so I wanted to get that fixed as “Step 0” before cleaning up the score.

Thank you again!

8

Page formatting is a breeze if you sort out your Page Templates first! :grinning:

9

Touche.

1 Like
10

One more thing, you’ve got quite a few hidden clef changes.

Screenshot
Screenshot1272×410 41.6 KB

That may have been something that came in on XML, but they’re not adding anything to your score, and can be deleted without consequence (AFAICS…)

Screenshot
Screenshot1426×456 49.8 KB

If you were trying to get a clef in the right place, remember that like everything else, you can move them along the grid with Alt left/right.

11

(No shame. We’ve all been there)