Can't get orphan system into a frame

I know this has been discussed many times before but I can’t find a way to get Dorico to include the system at the top of the second page at the bottom of the first. There’s plenty of room for it and I’ve even tried removing the tacets and the other system and frame breaks but every time I try this, Dorico simply moves movement 14b to the next page, leaving page 12 almost blank except for the orphan system. For obvious reasons I can’t post the file. Any hints?

Have you tried the following?

  1. Adding a Frame Break on the downbeat of 14b
  2. Setting the Frame Break at the top of 13b to “wait for next Frame break”

Still didn’t work. That last system of 14a remained an orphan until I reduced the ideal vertical distance between systems in that one layout, something I didn’t really want to have to do for the whole layout. Oh well, it works. Maybe my ability to judge what should fit onto a page is off!

If you want a definitive answer, copy the project, delete everything apart from that layout and that instrument, then upload it - I’m more than happy to take a look.

Thanks, pianoleo. I’m on a serious deadline right now but it’ll certainly come up again in the future, and I’ll take you up on the offer!
BTW, is there a way to change the intersystem gap between a number of systems or on a certain page, or does this come under the realm of manual positioning? If I could have done this for that one page, I could have solved the problem without having had to reduce the value for the entire part.

You know there is a manual Staff & system spacing mode in Engrave mode, right? You can input the value you want on the left of the page, between systems (starting from top to bottom) or move the systems and staves using the square handles. If it’s only for one page, it should work — providing that all the systems that should be on that page are already on it : it won’t free some space to allow a new system after the fact.


I have exactly the same problem and I can not understand why I can not add the system from page 6 to page 5. I feel that it is because of the TACET.
I tried to follow the advice of pianoleo but it does not change anything except that everything goes to page 6
I also want to clarify that if I want to remove the frame break from page 5, Dorico quits.

Thank you for your help


j’ai exactement le même problème et je n’arrive pas à comprendre pourquoi je ne peux pas rajouter le système de la page 6 à la page 5. J’ai l’impression que c’est à cause du TACET.
j’ai essayé de suivre les conseils de pianoleo mais ça ne change rien si ce n’est que tout passe à la page 6
Je tiens à préciser aussi que si je veux supprimer le saut de cadre de la page 5 , Dorico se ferme.

Merci de votre aide

I know, it’s the last point you made that’s the problem. It’s often possible to free up enough space for another system but Dorico has to realise that this is the case, and it doesn’t. In these cases, Dorico just turns the ‘extra’ system into an orphan. Tragic!

Clario, as per this post, please post a project, not a picture:

There’s a chance you’re missing something.

clario’s point is the same one I’m making. I’ve also attributed this behaviour to having tacets, and I’ve even removed them (by including the instrument in the flow) and tried including that music in the frame but Dorico still refuses to do this. Unfortunately it also happens in other instances without tacets. The only way I’ve been able to do it is to reduce the ideal intersystem gap for the entire layout which, of course, changes everything I’ve already done.

Yes, but Leo is still asking for a posted file from either of you so we can give it a look. If we can fix Clario’s problem, we can probably also fix yours.

I think that Clario’s problem in this particular instance could be solved by reducing the intersystem gap, as it looks fairly generous in his clarinet part, but this just transfers the problem; it’ll just pop up again in another instance.

I’ll try to post a file sometime soon but, as I wrote, I’m working against the clock.

At the request of pianoleo here is the file. I hope I followed the instructions.

Thank you all

A la demande de pianoleo voici le fichier. J’espère que j’ai bien suivi les consignes.

Merci à tous
Le vaisseau pour forum (606 KB)

Clario, follow the instructions I posted as the first reply to the original post, here:

They work.


Ok Vaughan, you’re the odd one out! :wink: Leo’s demonstrated that the tacet isn’t the problem, so it must be something else.

Actually, Dan, Vaughan’s demonstrated that tacets aren’t the problem.

Excellent! Thank you pianoleo. I did not understand the “wait for next frame”.
Like what a small GIF is sometimes better than a long explanation.
Thanks again


Excellent! Merci pianoleo. Je n’avais pas compris le “wait for next frame”.
Comme quoi un petit GIF vaut quelquefois mieux qu’une longue explication.
Encore merci

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