I’m encountering an issue with cautionary accidentals after grace notes that are not behaving as expected (Dorico 5.1.60). I’ve not been able to find an answer in previous posts. I have this setting selected in Notation Options:
I did this in a blank project but it happens in all my projects currently. This was not always the case as far as I can recall, but I don’t know when this behavior changed. Changing the setting to one of the other options and then changing it back makes no difference.
Weirdly, what does make a difference is this setting:
Those notes are all in the same bar, but for some reason the cautionary accidentals (but not all of them, note the C#) are affected by a setting that should only apply to notes in the following bar. The same thing happens when I change the “first occurence of the same note in the following bar” setting.
When I reset all options back to factory using the library manager and then apply the Show cautionary option to accidentals after grace notes again, the last screen shot is what remains (cautionaries on the F# and E natural, but not on the C#). Is there another setting I could have changed somewhere that might be interfering with this? Or can it be a bug, perhaps from the latest update? Wondering if other people are experiencing this as well… Thanks in advance!
Hello,
I’ve just reproduced your example: as you can see, the notation option works (in line with the key-signature).
The settings work (with or without, including parenthesis) are instant, without any necessity to re-input music.
However, my minim has no indication. I think that, visually, its proximity to the graces notes doesn’t hinder reading and a precautionary alteration might have been superfluous. My two cents.
NB: I’m using Dorico 5.1.51, not 5.1.6.
But no doubt members of this forum who works in the same version of the software as yours will be more helpful than I am…
Thanks for taking the time to check this! So there appear to be two different things going on at once:
The show cautionary after grace note setting does not have any effect unless the cautionary in following bar setting is also active, which makes no sense and which I don’t recall being a problem before… since you are still on version 5.1.51 and cannot reproduce this, it might be either the update or another setting I changed somewhere which is affecting this.
The appearance of the cautionary accidentals at notes to which the grace notes are attached (the half notes in our respective examples). It sounds logical that this could be caused by their proximity to the grace notes, but if this is intended behavior then the description of the setting in Notation Options is incomplete (it should at least mention that the setting does not apply to notes immediately following the grace notes that introduce the accidental). Also, the cautionary doesn’t appear no matter how many grace notes preceed the ‘main note’, so the proximity factor is I think a dubious one, and it appears to have the added side effect that the cautionary in question will not appear again in the bar at all:
Simply showing the accidentals at beat 1 and 2 would eliminate all ambiguity in this example, which is exactly what I would expect the Notation option on cautionaries after grace notes to take care of. So I’m hoping that this is not the intended behavior.
Edit: I just looked this up in Gould and she states that an accidental after a grace note should be shown “unless the measured note follows the graces note almost immediately” (p.84). This at least confirms that this is probably intended behavior, so I think a little clarification in the Notation options could help a great deal.
The first issue still remains though. If I have time I’ll try if I can figure out if another setting is causing this, but I’m hoping someone might have already experienced this before.
In Dorico 5.1.60, if the first three options under Notation Options > Accidentals > Cautionary Accidentals are set to No cautionary and the option Notes following grace notes that introduce an accidental is set to Show cautionary, then I can duplicate the second screenshot in the original post. However, if I change any of the first three options to Show cautionary, then I get the last screenshot in the original post.
Thanks for checking! I can confirm this. This might also explain why I had not noticed this before. Usually I have the “same octave, following bar” option set to Show cautionary but lately I’ve been messing around with these settings. Seems like a bug to me!
Yeah I figured as much when giving it some more thought. I’m fine with that as well, it makes sense (but I still think some textual clarification in the settings window would be nice). It was bycatch to the main issue in the original post though.
Hi! Dorico 5.1.60 user. I’m also struggling with this behavior too.
I’ve been using Show Cautionary option successfully, but noticed this problem in a recent arrangement using grace notes in thirds, as you can see in the screenshots.
It has a high D# as a grace note in the upper voice, and a D# in the lower voice on the following 8th. It should automatically show a sharp, since I checked Show Cautionary, but it doesn’t.
If it was a piano part, omitting the sharp on the D after the grace note would be ok, but it’s a violin section part, and each voice needs its own accidental.
I had to add the accidentals to each D# using the Properties panel.
It really seems to be a very annoying bug. Or maybe Dorico needs more options for cautionary accidentals after grace notes, specially when we have 2 or more voices.
Well, calling it a bug is a bit much. Notes in the same bar ‘generally’ don’t need a restated accidental.
But I agree: in divisi passages, each part must have their own accidentals (regardless of grace notes, BTW) because the voices are read by separate musicians. I often use two voices in one staff if the divisi is simple and homophonic, instead of a full-fledged condensed divisi. It always needs special attention to get the accidentals right for both. Tricky thing for sure.
Just for further clarification: the Option says “Notes following grace notes that introduce an accidental”.
What is the key of your piece? Is the D# a newly introduced accidental?
