cut out score update

at the top of my wishlist for dorico is cutout staves as in late stravinsky,
where silent measures are blank and the music has staves. This is also useful
where you might want a floating fragment or fragments for improvisation.
This is possible particularly in score (runs in dos) or winscore. It is also possible
in an older program from graphire music press (not as old as score) that is still available from Ernie
Mansfield. This program allows you to place a staff or staves across a page, place
music where you want it, hide the staves and sketch in new staves where the music is. The result is
while out where is no music and what appears to be floating fragments.
It has boxes to box the music and text, floating arrows, wavy lines, etc. Sibelius can do this,
but it is such a slave to the measure, it is difficult to work with. I have an example in dropbox
for anyone interested. gmp is a notation program and not a playback application.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7r208lzymaoxt7v/trio%20for%20cl%2C%20vl%20and%20cello.pdf?dl=0

rather than take up your time here, I would be glad to explain how to do this in gmp for anyone
interested. Looking forward to the future with Dorico, but for now, when I need cut-outs, floating
lines, objects, etc this works for me.

We certainly plan to add features for this in future, but I’m afraid it’s not going to be part of our next major release.

daniel
I celebrate my 76th birthday this june (is celebrate the right word, really?) and need now the tools that graphire music press gives me. Sibelius is such a slave to the measure and cumbersome that gmp is a better alternative for me for such techniques. I was first-in-line to initially buy, learn and use dorico and I have done so for major releases. at 76 (without being morbid) to wait for cut-out scores and floating fragments, arrows, lines, etc is exciting but realistically I might not be here using it with dorico. I do admit to having a child-like excitement when you announce that a new major release is in the near future. it’s a bit like waking up on your birthday and hoping for that special present,then the short-lived disappointment and finally “yes, this is wonderful.” I am truly looking forward to dorico’s future and being here to use it and be part of it.

I remember BBC Radio 3 interviewed Elliott Carter on his 100th birthday. The only question that left him speechless was “Now you have reached 100, do you have any plans to slow down your work rate?”

never. slowdown, never. we need tools now, whenever we can find them. but, indeed. carter, samuel adler, milton babbit, crumb were special people in many ways. I knew babbit and know adler and was at the premiere of crumb’s black angels. special people,all. but, I guess I am a realist. moments when I was younger I could put off a bit. they asked woody allen is there anything good about getting old and he said nothing (but the moments we do have we cherish and feel compelled to wisely use). slow down, never, but we can’t waste the time that we might have by not using tools that we need if we can.

do remember sharing space and a too brief bit of time with carter and stockhausen, together. remarkable musical minds.

Following up on this comment from Danial, does this mean that there will be no improvisation boxes or arrows in the next release?
Its kind of standard in a LOT of modern music being written in the last 40 or so years.

If Its not, I will have to finish up a bunch of projects in Finale (…shudder…).
Please don’t make me do that.

Workaround? Is there a graphic tool that I can easily use for this in Dorico,
or should I do this once the score is finished, and use another program to generate those graphics?

All that being said, I’m amazed at how Dorico is coming along,
and am blown away by the dedication you folks have for this.
Bravo.

If you are already familiar with doing these things in Finale, you are probably safer doing this there (especially if you are working to deadline). As you say, Dorico is progressing quickly; but it is best to use Dorico to do the things it can do (either natively or with minor work-arounds) rather than depending on it to do things it is not yet prepared to.

Just my two cents.

Burton, this discussion may interest you:

https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=163280&p=878152#p878152

Istvan, you can do similar sorts of workarounds in Dorico to those you would do in Finale. You can create extra frames in Engrave mode and set them to have a border, and position them where you want them, and you could use the Arrow Crafter font to make arrows using text items, etc., but it’s certainly the case that these are going to be more brittle than using native features to achieve these kinds of notations.

Hmm, Thanks, Dan. Seriously. I will give this a try!
I am not sure about how to get the font you speak of in action, but I will try to find this out either in help or in the forums itself.
I dont need anything too fancy, just a series of improvisation boxes with a few pitches, directions, etc.
Its awkward in every type of program I have ever used, and would be a gift from the heavens if this were made more easy in the future. :slight_smile: