Data Loss Bug/Quirk with Project Backup!

Yes, the difference there is the contention.

When thinking about the Backup Project dialogue popping up… Do these options apply to the Current Active Project, or do they apply to the Backup Copy?

Now, and I did think in my head… well, maybe selecting ‘Keep Current Active Project’ should change the protocol and apply to active… but that still doesn’t really make sense… imo

Well. In any case, to report a bug we would have to compare an apple to an apple, or an orangutan to another orangutan (the latter might be too dangerous)

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REPRODUCTION SEQUENCE :

Part 1 :

  • Create new Project,
  • Add 2 Audio Tracks and import or record audio on each one,
  • Save the project.
  • Delete one Track,
  • Create Backup and select a new folder,
  • On the Backup dialog, only check Remove Unused Files.
  • Proceed.
  • Result : The Backup project opens automatically.
  • Close the Backup project,
  • Load the Original project,
  • Result : The Original project has no missing tracks, everything is ok.

Part 2:

  • Now create a Backup once again on a different folder,
  • On the Backup dialog, check both of Keep Current Project Active and Remove Unused Files,
  • Proceed.
  • Result : The Original project stays opened.
  • Close the Original project,
  • Load the Original project again,
  • Result : The Original project opens as an exact copy of the Backup.

This confirms the Keep Current Project Active saves the current project at the same time the Backup is created. This is indeed not expected, and can lead to immeasurable loss of time if Auto-Save was disabled and this was the only save file available for the project.

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Thank you, and thank you for turning around on this one (even though the protocol is perhaps debatable)… most aren’t like that, shows character strength. :v:

I believe they are also gone from the Audio Folder… both in my project, and in my tests… that’s what I found… maybe there’s a variable of difference in our testing method?


I mean… just from the angle alone of someone maybe accidentally having that option checked without realizing it, without being aware of this difference… or… someone who is just not aware of the difference… :bangbang: danger :bangbang:


And to add onto that… and I don’t do this personally because I don’t trust the ‘Pool’, but some people use the Pool as a sort of library of files they are keeping at least for the time being. ie, some stuff they are hanging onto, is not on the project timeline… And in this scenario, if ‘Keep Current Project Active’ is enabled… they will lose everything in their pool that isn’t on the project timeline.

Me personally, I put the ‘keep in case’ stuff in a folder, disabled, and hidden. But I know for certain, some people use the Pool as a library of sorts to work from.

So it would appear that the status of what audio files are used/unused is not updated correctly? Are the audio files actually deleted?

In my tests they were.

had to recover from True Image backup

The files are only removed from the project and the Pool, but remain in the Audio folder.

Can you please reconfirm that, not my findings

Those are my findings for the Original project, not the Backup of course…

Okay I will retest on my end

Thanks. This is a hard to repro issue, thanks for doing the repro. I’ll post back once I’ve reported, but first I’ll watch this topic for any additions.

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So the gist of it is if you do a backup and keep the current project active and delete unused files you will not be able to use undo on you main project.

So if you keep the main project active it deletes the files and then creates the backup.

If you don’t keep it active it creates the backup and only deletes files from that.

hmm, on my retest… the files were still in the audio folder… but i swear it hard removed files from both the active and backup audio folders.

so either I’m mistaken, or, there’s another variable somewhere.

This is why simple and brief repro sequences are needed. While you create one you are forced to reveal every nuance each step might cause. It’s rather painstaking work.

I did end up putting one at the bottom of the OP but it wasn’t as good as Louis, as I was in the process of figuring out what exactly the repro was.

I will do some more testing as, there might be a variable with how the project has been saved before doing the back up.

virtual hugs everyone hugs

It’s possible I was mistaken for sure… but I did have to drag in audio files from TI backup and there were for sure some missing because windows didn’t ask me to overwrite… and I hadn’t done any local project cleanup actions yet. I’m 75% sure I looked into the active project audio folder to recover and couldn’t get the numbered audio files I needed.

So I’m going back and trying to recreate all the conditions that I can remember…

It’s using which ever project is active as the basis to remove files. It has always done that though. That’s why I hate it.

If you use the remove unused data from pool (clips etc) it does the exact same, it deletes everything not used by the current project in the audio pool for that project, even if the data is used in other projects. It only looks at the current open active project. It’s been like that for a long time.

What is worse is by default in the hub will put the audio from all projects into one folder shared pool folder (a more terrible idea I cannot even fathom). So anyone pressing the remove unused files will delete all audio from all of their projects that are not currently active and share that pool.

That is what needs to be made very very clear in the manual and it’s not made clear. The system does not check if the audio is used in any project closed or not active. It has always deleted based on the active project.

But actually the backup is doing what is expected, it’s removing the audio based on the active project. It’s just that if you do not keep your main project active the backup is made and becomes active.

It’s not a nice function, I’m quite scared of it. I use it to make new projects from my demo project but I would never use it outside of that. It’s too scary to contemplate that by accident you have select the default audio directory and suddenly all you audio goes missing from multiply project.

It would be far better if the manual was very very clear on what it is about to do and if there is any undo or not on that function.

To be fair, I’m pretty certain it works this way in other DAWs as well… i had a Ableton friend lose all their audio the same way.

1.) It would reຊuire some pretty clever code to sort out what you are saying, probably OS dependent as well

2.) It could create a different kind of mess if it didn’t work the way it currently does. How would the program know what the user wants referenced and or doesn’t care to be referenced? That could be very annoying and confusing very ຊuickly if your old backups are chirping.

imo, the best solution to the issue you’re bringing forward… would be to just get rid of the “default location” (I always stayed away from that) protocol and FORCE users to create separate project folder directories as that’s the better engineering work ethic anyways which should be encouraged.

But this is an entirely different subject and problem, so I would start a separate thread.

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That is the best thing and I wish they would do it. What Cubase is doing is inviting ppl to destroy their music on a large basis.

When I first stated to use the hub that happened to me and I lost about two years of audio. I had no idea the hub was using a default location. Some audio I found and some was just gone.

They need to update the manual, make it clear there is no coming back from it.

But it would be nice if they just moved the audio to a delete folder or the bin. So the user has to option to put it back or really delete for good once they know the damage it has/ has not caused lol

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