It would be great to automatically set the transposing/concert clef preferences and have them save with the instrument in the instruments.xml file. This isn’t possible now, is it? For example, Bass Clarinet and Baritone Sax will almost always use bass clef in a concert score (or a working score when writing in concert) but will be in notated in treble clef in the parts and transposed score. If there’s a way to just save that with the instrument so I don’t have to manually make that change any time I add one of those instruments, please let me know, thanks! If it’s not possible now, I definitely would like to add a feature request to be able to assign differing default concert and transposed clefs and have them saved in the instrument definitions.
Both of those instruments (Bass Clarinet and Baritone Saxophone) have those precise options available in the instrument picker - check the third column when adding/changing instruments and look out for the “Bass Clef Full score” type.
It’s worth being aware of these alternative types for instruments, as for e.g. horns as well there are a number of different and useful alternatives. Similarly for fretted instruments, there are different tunings available without you having to edit instruments individually in the Edit Strings and Tuning dialog.
D’oh! You are right of course. I should have double-checked that before typing. Thanks!
I found this thread in my (long) search how to make a score with baritone sax in F-clef and G-clef in the part. Just like Fred discribed above. For some reason I cannot get it working.
I tried the ‘instrument picker’ as Lillie suggested and ended with bariton 1 and 2 within the same bariton player. I set bari 1 to ‘Bass clef full score’. Set bari 2 to ‘sounds 8va bassa’ .
The part seems to be okay but the score is still in G-clef. What do I miss?
Instead of adding another Bari in Setup, use Change Instrument instead. Alternatively if you’ve already been working with an existing project, input a manual clef at the very beginning (this won’t work on a “default” clef), right-click it, choose Clef, then either Concert or Transposed pitch and choose whatever you want.
In another thread, and due to working later on a different score, I acknowledge that there are things that can be different in score and parts. I would not go as far as to consider different transpositions (even of octaves); but certainly I see no reason why the first bassoon, or similar, should not have the tenor clef in the part, and the bass clef in the score, in order to accommodate a second bassoon part on the same stave that is so low that it demands the bass clef. I dont think this is going to cause confusion in rehearsal.
David
I virtually always have the parts and score match with clefs since I always use transposed scores for the final product. For me it’s more of an issue with composing. I’d much rather have the Baritone Sax be in bass clef when in concert pitch, as I’m not really comfortable reading treble clef 8 ledger lines below the staff, LOL. Switching between bass clef for concert, and treble for transposed makes this reasonable.
Same here Fred.
I mainly do big band and use transposed scores for the final product but hate the leger lines when working in concert pitch. Especially for baritone saxophone.
I still don’t know what setting was wrong but now I’ve got it working anyhow. Thanks for your input!
Many concert pitch scores still use octave transpositions for things like piccolo and bari-sax and others. If you don’t want to do that, use the treble-clef-octave-down (as is often used for Tenor voice) or bass-clef-octave-up (as is often used for bass recorder) or treble-clef-octave-up (as is often used for soprano recorder). That way no actual transposition takes place, the clefs are accurate and the leger lines are greatly reduced.
Octave transpositions for Picc, Guitar, Double Bass, etc are all often assumed in concert scores, but I’ve never seen this for Bari Sax. What do they do, transpose it exactly the same as Alto Sax, and then it’s assumed to be an octave lower? That seems quite problematic as the octave could be unclear. If Alto and Bari are in unison in the same register, then the Bari appears written an octave higher in a concert score so the assumed octave makes it unison? I’ve honestly never seen this, can you post an example of a concert score by a reputable publisher that shows a bari sax in treble clef?
Just a little example with some Thad Jones …
Transposed score
Concert score, different clefs
Concert score, same clefs
No one wants to read the concert version with the Bari in treble clef.
Are you aware that you can chose ”baritone saxophone, bass clef concert score” when selecting the instrument? I do the same often for tenor 2.
Not only the baritone but the 2nd tenor as well in bass clef, even better to work in.
I think I made a setting wrong in ‘Clef and Transposition overrides’ in my search ‘how to’.
But again, I got it working now. Thanks!
Yeah, that’s how I have my big band template set up for writing. Easy enough to switch if needed but 3 saxes in treble and 2 in bass when in concert pitch seems to be pretty efficient. Of course we’re also fairly used to reading many ledger lines above a bass clef staff (in lead Trombone parts for example) so I generally don’t care if Tenor 2 goes fairly high. It’s the many ledger lines below a treble clef staff that trips me up.
Shouldn’t tenor saxophone that is transposing 8va bassa use the right clef in concert score to indicate that it indeed is notated one octave higher?
If I select that instrument, I get this in concert score:
and this in transposing score:
It is also not possible to change the clef manually to affect only concert score, since dorico doesn’t allow that at the beginning of the flow.
I honestly don’t really know. I don’t think it’s a good idea to use octave transpositions in concert scores with instruments that also transpose an interval, so I never use this. It seems too unclear as to what octave the instrument is really in. If the instrument transposes a 9th, I show it a 9th lower in concert, not a 2nd.
This won’t work on a “default” clef, you need to manually add a clef. Once you manually add a clef you can click it to change Concert/Transposed settings.
This works everywhere else, but not at the beginning of the score (the only place I would like to put it… 
)
Hmm, it seems to work for me. I just added a Tenor Sax “Sounds 8va bassa” instrument, input a manual clef and I can select it at the beginning. I’m not sure what could be different about your score that it wouldn’t work.
I get this if I try to do it:
The problem is that the "8"shows also in the transposing layout, which is then of course wrong
