Dorico 4 & VEPRO Playback Audio Outputs

Am giving Dorico and VEPRO yet another try after months away from it. Have a failure to get correct audio output. I have four instruments setup in VEPRO each of which is connected to a separate Dorico instance of VEPRO. The instruments seem to be playing correctly as viewed from VEPRO, but the output in Dorico is not right. Each of the 4 instruments in VEPro have different outputs as they’re part of large template. The Dorico Mixer shows something completely different:

VEPRO Outputs.==== Dorico Mixer Outputs
3-4 =================== 7,8
1-2 =================== 17,18
5-6 ===================.27,28
1-2 =================== 63,64

Hoping to NOT have to change the VEPRO template, but not looking good and have no idea where Dorico got those outputs. Anyone have any ideas what to do?

Can you post a minimal version of your project? It might help people figure out what’s going on.

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Hi @Shubus , that’s right what Eggsalad says. You can even delete every note from the project, we just need to see the VST setup of your project. Thanks

Here is an overlay of the 4 instances in VEPro. From Left to Right see Horn, Chorus, Piano, and Violin.

Dorico Track Inspector

Dorico VST & MIDI

Overlay of Dorico Mixer outputs (!)

I’m sure I’m doing something stupid. During playback only the Horn and the Violins sound. The Choir and Piano are missing. Hope this helps in diagnosing my problem! Thanks!

Thanks for all the screenshots, but I’m still puzzled.
So you say that VEPro receives MIDI for all instruments and produces sound for all of them and that VEPro is showing metering for every instrument, is that correct?
But in the Dorico mixer the Piano and Choir channels show no metering at all, correct?
Either there is something wrong in the VEPro output routing then, or the input routing of Dorico. About the former I can’t say anything and for the latter I would need the Dorico project file.
As I said, you can delete the whole score and then save under a different name and post that project file here. Since it still contains the player and instrument setup, that gives me enough information.

Here is a dropbox link containing the Dorico file without score. Even with no score and just 4 players the file weighs in at 122 MB! Here is a link to it in Dropbox. It seems one needs to have a Dropbox account to share a file: TinyUrl used to shorten the link:
Have not had good luck with Dorico today. My test file crashed when clicking on any of the Solo or Mute buttons, so had to recreate from scratch…and this is the linked file.

I double checked what was sounding and what wasn’t. and it’s 1 instrument (Horn) and the 4th instrument (Violins). Only these two light up in VEPRO when Play is pressed. And the Solo and Muted buttons don’t seem to work at all, but least on this re-created file pressing either one does NOT crash Dorico.

I am doubtful that there is anything wrong the VEPRO routine as it all works fine in Cubase–as does my entire template which is quite large.

Greatly appreciate the help on this. P.S.: I’m beginning to suspect something maybe awry with the Dorico Mixer—which was re-written recently as I recall…

122MB ?! The whole Rite of Spring is only 15.

Hi @Shubus ,
thanks for the data. Most of the 120MB accounts for audio engine data and in particular for plug-in state data. Must be from VEPro, but I really wonder, normally that should not happen with VEPro, but anyway, that is not the main problem here.
So you have 4 VEPro instancces and each of them presents 40 output ports to the Dorico mixer, and so Dorico creates in total 120 channels for them. Tracing all the routing from the data is too difficult for me. I need my development tools for analysing this, which I don’t have at hand right now. I will come back as soon as possible.

Greatly appreciate your help on this, Ulf. My expectation has been that if VEPro works with Cubase then it should work with Dorico in a similar manner by matching Instances, channels and ports. But I could be wrong about that.

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You might consider changing your approach to VEP outputs. I settled on an instance setup with multiple buses feeding one main out. This greatly streamlines the interaction between VEP and Dorico.

Your mixing would then be done in VE Pro. If you do this you probably want to “clone” your VE Pro template to produce a VEP file uniquely named for each project. That way you can be sure any mixing doesn’t affect your base template. This also lets you cut out anything in your template that you’re sure you don’t need for a particular project.

Don’t know if this is helpful.

Yes, I’ve considered the option of cloning the VEPro template and customizing it for each project. But this is exactly the scenario I’m trying to avoid as it creates an immense amount of work.

Even without my development tools at hand, I’ve been thinking about the ports assignment .
You said it is like
VEPRO Outputs.==== Dorico Mixer Outputs
3-4 =================== 7,8
1-2 =================== 17,18
5-6 ===================.27,28
1-2 =================== 63,64

Now looking again at your Track Inspector, the first VEPro instance receives MIDI on Port 1 and Channel 4 and Dorico receives audio from the 4th output port so that matches the 7,8. Likewise does the assigned MIDI channel match the output port in all other instances as well. E.g. the choir receives on MIDI channel 9 and also outputs on the 9th output port (17,18). Same holds true for Piano and Violins. Well, Violins is a little different, it’s port 2 channel 16, that is 2 times 16 equals 32 which matches 63,64. So this all makes sense. There is only one misconception on your side and that you speak of Dorico Mixer Outputs, but they are actually instrument return channel which get fed by the corresponding output ports of the VEPro instances. The instrument return channels in Dorico inherit as name the port names from VEPro; that:s why they are named like 7,8 or 63,64.
Now, you say that Choir and Piano don’t work, but Horns and Violins do. Looking at the Track Inspector, I see for Piano and Choir input port 10 resp. 4, so I’m inclined to say that here is the problem. What if you set those two also to port 1?

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OP would need to work in decouple mode, that way Dorico only saves the connection information (ports, channels, etc), instead of all the plugin data from VEPro, thus decreasing file size and load/save times.

The caveat is that you need to create a habit of saving your VEPro server, otherwise changes in plugins are lost when you close the project. Another option, which is the way I usually work, is to have a master VEPro template (decoupled AND preserved, so I can switch cues) and automate all plugin parameters within Dorico via MIDI, that way I can recall instrument changes without having to actually save any plugin information locally in Dorico.

Not sure if that’s useful for OP (or make any sense haha), but I hope it helps.

Hi Ulf,
I won’t quite understand how this mapping between VEPRO & Dorico works especially regarding the Dorico Mixer Outputs being fed by the VEPRO instances as there is nothing related to Ports 63,64 in VEPRO. In Dorico I tried changing the Choir to Port 1 Channel 9 and the Piano to Port 1 Channel 14 and sorry to report but alas the choir & piano are still silent.

Hi Zolhof,
I’m thinking of trying your method of work and have thought about running VEPro in decoupled mode. Will give that a shot once this port mapping is figured out. Greatly appreciate your explanation of how to use VEPRO & Dorico.

I think we explained this over a year ago: Dorico and VEPro Port 2 and beyond
As has been mentioned several times over the years, there is currently a limitation to the number of stereo feeds to the Dorico mixer from a single VEPro instance. This is set to 16 for 16 midi channels. You can easily have Port 1, channels 1 to 16 coming into the Dorico mixer on 16 different stereo channels, but once you use more than one port in a VEPro instance, the outputs will start overlapping and will therefore not work: If you have say an instrument on Port 1 midi channel 1 you will hear that in Dorico, no problem. If you then have another instrument in the same VEPro instance on Port 2, midi channel 1, it will not come into the Dorico mixer as a separate channel, and you will not hear anything because midi channel 1 is already assigned to Port 1. If you un-assign your Port 1 instrument, you will hear your Port 2 instrument.
It is therefore recommended to use 16 channels per instance, all on Port 1 to get 16 channels in the Dorico mixer.
If, however, you assign all your instruments in VEPro to the Stereo bus, they will come into the Dorico mixer on one stereo fader, and you can use as many Ports in a VEPro instance as you want.
I don’t know what it will take for this limitation to change or expand, but it has always been like this thus far.