Double hairpin >< on Piano incorrectly modifies velocities as <> instead

On both Dorico Pro & SE v4.3.30.1132 on Windows 10

To reproduce, just create a solo piano project, add some notes on the treble clef, select them, open gradual dynamics and click ><.
Looking at the dynamics lane, it all looks as it should. However, switch to the velocity lane and the >< has actually modified the velocities as <>.
A semi-workaround is to go back to the dynamics lane and move the centre up, then back down slightly. If you now go back to the velocity lane, the velocities are now as you would expect.

Basically Dorico makes the wrong adjustments to the velocities when the >< is created, but any dynamic edits do the right thing, and correct the original bug.

Unfortunately, the dynamic lane editing is a only semi-workaround. That’s because, at the moment, I can’t find any way to edit the bass clef dynamics when using independent treble and bass clef dynamics. When using separate dynamics, with only a >< on the bass clef, there is no way afaik to edit the bass clef dynamics (i.e. select it in the dynamics lane and do the up/down wiggle).

BTW, the >< works fine on any instrument that doesn’t use the velocity adjustment method Dorico uses like with piano.

I’d be very grateful if anyone knows how to edit dynamics entered on bass clef only in the dynamics lane. (I of course know the Alt key method of entry and otherwise know how to control/enter voice specific dynamics for each staff).

One can either send the treble and bass clef voices to different instances of the piano VST, or one can use the key editor to adjust the velocity for the voices separately (may need to use Independent Voice Playback to give separate velocity tracks).

Without seeing the context your >< appears to be a reverse Messa di voce, a technique normally used only on the note of a sustaining instrument, which makes your technique seems odd for a piano. If expended over multiple notes, perhaps entering the hairpins separately would be advisable.

I can reproduce this as described. Very odd. As a work-around you can add decrescendo and crescendo hairpins separately under their respective notes.

Hi Derrek, thanks for your reply.

Ha ha yes, I’m not trying to use >< on a single note (I recall a pianist joke here), but on a span of multiple notes, where using the double hairpin is much more convenient than entering the hairpins separately.

I can edit the velocities for each note, but that defeats the object of using the hairpin (and other dynamics) in the first place. I’d rather use Cubase for that sort of thing.

Also, I didn’t mention but I’m not using a piano VST, but a Yamaha Disklavier C3X, so I don’t really want to have to have two instances!

Yes, separate hairpins is also a workaround, but it’s a very odd bug.

My real frustration is that Dorico is almost fantastic, but at the moment has got enough issues with dynamics (and dynamics editing) to make it very difficult for me to use as I should be able to. There’s also some weird last note of slur/legato note length issues, which are causing issues on my Disklavier, but I can cope with those by manual editing of the note length.

I’m still hoping someone has a magic way for me to edit just the bass clef dynamics in the dynamics lane.

Welcome to the forum, @inyouendo, and thanks for reporting this problem. I can confirm the issue, and I’ll make sure it gets fixed in our next release.

Regarding being able to edit the dynamics for each voice independently, have you considered enabling independent voice playback in Play mode?


Glad you can confirm, and thank you, you’re a star! I’d missed that feature, doh! That gives me the workaround I needed for the time being, and also gives me the dynamic control I needed.