Expression Map Converter

Since there is a German developer of expression maps (but for Cubase) for very many sound libraries (company babylonwaves), and a use of expression maps created for Cubase is possible in Dorico after a lot of rework - how about developing a converter that converts expression maps and drum maps (the original file remains of course)?

Welcome to the forum. I’m not sure I understand your post, I’m afraid. You can already import Cubase expression maps into Dorico to the extent that it makes sense, given the very different capabilities of Dorico and Cubase in this area.

Hi Daniel, I think I wrote a mail or two to you before a long time (2007 or 2008, at your Sibelius era).
There is another way to solve my problem: Dorico should be able to load drum maps from Cubase. Or, what would be even simpler: complete freedom in creating the terms in the percussion map, without any obligation to use the usual playing instructions in Dorico. This also works in Cubase. In attachment you will find 2 pictures for better understanding.
I currently prefer the libraries of the Vienna Symphonic Library and would like to purchase Great Rieger Organ from this company. Again, I need to create an expression map so that Dorico knows where to get these sounds. Now the question arises whether these registrations of this organ should be listed as program changes in the expression map?
Finally, a compliment: Dorico is fantastic, very logically structured. However, it is very difficult for me to make cross-project default settings. There should be an option here in the library. So far, I haven’t found any.

Vienna Jazzdrums Maps.pdf (392 KB)

Percussion maps in Dorico have a very different purpose to drum maps in Cubase, because all Cubase needs to know is a name and a MIDI pitch. Dorico needs to know how to map the sounds in the patch to particular instruments and playing techniques for the purposes of producing practical music notation. There’s no semantic meaning behind Cubase drum maps: just a MIDI pitch and a free text name. As such, any attempt that we might make to try and import this data into Dorico and produce the required mappings to instruments and playing techniques is destined for failure.

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I think I have now found the solution to my percussion map problem myself: in the manual on page 939. Edit Drum Kit Note subsection: Name: The displayed name for the specific combination of instrument and playback technique. You may choose to input the name used in the manufacturer’s documentation for your VST instrument or MIDI output device.

Hi Daniel,
Dorico has better Expression and Percussion Maps system than Cubase.
I also would like to use the same sets both in Dorico and Cubase.
Cubase needs to adopt the EMs and PMs integrated in Dorico, because they are mandatory linked with techniques and expressions, while in Cubase you even don’t have to map them to e certain technique, just you need to assign the proper KS, CC or PC. At the end, if you would like to use the Score Editor with Expression Maps sets created by Babylonwaves, everything looks terrible on the sheet.
Actually I’m expecting to such Expression and Percussion Maps improvement in the next major upgrade of Cubase . The release broke the year cycle with around 4 months…
By the way, once I’ve shared with you an idea about Expression and Percussion Maps standardization for all DAWs and Scoring apps. That way a single set of EMs, or PMs will be available for all of them. :slight_smile:

Best regards,
Thurisaz :slight_smile:

Thanks, now I get it. But I have now found the solution to my problem in the user manual on page 939.

Hi Thurisaz,

I compared the data sets of Babylonwave’s Expression Maps with the values of the Kontakt Instrument Ethno World 6 Pro and could not find any deviations. What would be to complain about: Babylonwaves completely dispenses with the Midi-CC control, so that no Note Expression access is possible. You can only work with keyswitches, which is a significant limitation of the wide range of control that an expression map otherwise offers.

Hi @aelbler-ralf ,
Most of the issues in Babylonwaves sets for Cubase, aren’t caused by the EMs developer, but by how the Expression and Percussion Maps features are designed in Cubase.
In Cubase one can create an Expression Maps set without mapping them to an existing, musical symbols, which isn’t possible in Dorico (which is good). I would love to the Dorico approach adopted in Cubase, because it’s the better way. Most probably we’ll need a Playing technique creator tool, like in Dorico, which will allow us to create custom techniques.

Hi Daniel,

could you imagine an integration of NKS into Dorico or should it be reserved for DAWs?
Meanwhile, many manufacturers of sound libraries offer such integration. If an expression map with all the necessary parameters such as keyswitches and note percussion was created via Midi CC, NKS would have the advantage of an immediate coupling with the endless knobs on the Komplete Kontrol S88 MKII, for example.

Hi Thurisaz,

I had to add some specific playing techniques (single stroke, x-stick, stick on stick, backside, drag, ruff) to the unpitched instruments in Dorico. Which is understandable, because Dorico has the most important playing techniques with it, but the developers have given the user the opportunity to add some for their own needs.
Unfortunately, I have found that the translation program you are proposing has some weaknesses. If you prefer to use the word game instructions (correct term to use: playing techniques, in german: Spielanweisungen), I would suggest using the term game techniques (wrong again! playing techniques!) in the future. Even then, the translation reveals serious weaknesses, because I had to constantly make improvements. It has been claimed that the translation is able to convey even complex content of this certainly not simple topic without errors. I cannot leave this uncommented. It is incredibly important to me that both the developers and the other participants in the forum know what exactly is meant by my posts. This also eliminates the need to ask questions. This is where deepl needs to make a lot of improvements. Artificial intelligence can do a lot, but not everything.