Expression Maps for solo & Ensemble

HI

I have a question. I am trying to build a score template and want the brass all played by the fab VSL synchron brass. I’d like the player to have both solo and ensemble patches loaded at the same time so I can access them from the same staff. Ideally i’d like to be able to type “a6” for enable patches and either leave blank or “solo” for solo patches. I’d also like the various markings Tenuto.stacc,marcto etc to be consistent between both groups. Please could someone offer suggestions as to how this is best achieved. I have built a expression map no problem but I am having trouble accessing the two subgroups. For instance I created a technique called “solo: but it is always overridden by"natrual” !

any help would be most appreciated

best

e

Would using separate voices assigned to different MIDI channels allow you to alternate between ensemble and solo sounds on a single staff?

yes…that would work but I am trying to do it on the same player

best

e

These are separate voice in the same player.

I may be missing something here but can you not simply add the ensemble instrument under the solo one for the same player. Technically that’s nonsense but I don’t see why it should matter in practice. You would use different channels and switch between them in galley view. As you’re probably aware, moving the section to the appropriate instrument automatically creates an instrument change in the score so call the abbreviation at least tutti or solo or as preferred. You don’t need to do anything else yourself.

Not owning the full synchron brass, I don’t know whether the ensemble and solo instruments in this particular library have the same articulations and thus the same expression maps – I would expect them to be the same in fact-- but if they aren’t they should at least have the same mappings across the patches they have in common so you would presumably duplicate the solo EM and just change anything that’s different.

surely, an instrument has different voices, not a player. I see this as a case for two instruments on separate channels, not two voices (although there nothing to stop these being added too, if required)

yes you can . But I just for simplicity would like to duplicate what normally happens. a3 (or whatever) when appropriate. Pretty much like you do in Sibelius with Noteperformer.

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Both @dko22 and I have given you ways to address your situation in Dorico. You said you were using VSL, not NotePerformer. You can set an a 6 Playing Technique and accompanying Playback Technique to change MIDI channel if that seems simpler to you. If you want to do it some other way, fine. Best of luck to you.

yes…I know both these methods . Once again…thank you. As far as I know you can’t have multiple midi inputs to a synchrom player instance. You’d have to have a separate player for solo. THIS is what I am trying to avoid. But it seems like there is no current solution. I didn’t see that Ed had a similar issue. My bad for not spotting this thread earlier:

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e

As solo and ensemble are different instruments in VSL then you’ve summed up the issue correctly. There may be some way round the multiple MIDI inputs using Vienna Ensemble Pro (or some other host if you have it), though I’m not sure myself how. If there is, then perhaps someone will see the thread and chip in. But comparisons with NotePerformer will unfortunately get you nowhere as the two libraries work in completely different ways.

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You could build you own presets for the Synchron Player incorporating patches from the solo/ensembles you want to include. Quite a bit of work I would imagine.

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ok

I have a6 working well here. So my next questions is:

If I want basically the same set of articutions for ensemble and solo ( I do )…Is there a simple way of applying “solo” as a modifier and switching to that column for every patch. I am sorry if this seems longwinded or fiddly but I’d really like to do it if poss.

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no…this is what I have done…works like a treat !!

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yes…my mistake NOTEPERFORMER is a different beast. And TBH now I have DORICO playing back my samples i’ve long since left it behind

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yes, I was thinking of suggesting this but I wasn’t sure of the practicalities in this particular case, not knowing the library. But I frequently borrow missing articulations from other instruments to get round this. VSL don’t recommend it but it’s better that than having something like trills, for instance, arbitrarily excluded from instruments which need them.

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This is what I have done. So basically I have One instance of Synchron Horns. This has solo AND ensemble players. A6 works fine, so I just have to program this in such a way that a6 OR solo triggers the right collection of samples,

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surely this will depend on the instrument design? I can only see it working if the tree has common switches between solo and non solo, with a different branch of the tree adding an extra line for solo. For instance the VSL Dimension strings SE version does things this way. You have one branch for the player configuration which does not alter anything else so you can then create EM add-ons for “solo”, “divisi 1”, “desk3”, “tutti” etc.

From your latest post, it looks like you have already worked out a way that works with Synchron Horns.

i’m not sure I have !..there are some articulations that are common to both a6 and solo. So I need to make sure that having a6 above the notes still plays back the stacc symbols but from the right column. And like wise solo !

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e

yes, working with VSL libraries can be a bit of a jigsaw puzzle but I’m sure you’ll get there :smiley:

I just can’t figure out how to have too totally different patches understand the symbols. Stacc will for the playback of a particular patch. I need it to force the playback of either a6 or solo !

best

e