Feature Request - linked parts to reduction so change in part changes reduction

Occasionally, there is a need to make a few changes or corrections in a multi-instrument score that includes a piano reduction just prior to providing a final copy to the client. This could be to correct an error in notation or simply to add a last minute change. It would be nice if there were a way to link the reduction to the instruments included in the reduction such that changes in pitch or rhythm on the part are automatically reflected in the reduction without having to redo the reduction. I am aware of the linked dynamics but am asking that this concept be expanded to include notation. If there is already a method to do this, I would appreciate some tutelage. Thanks!

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The coder part of my mind goes, “arrrrrggggggg”. The composer part goes, “this is totally necessary.”

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It’s still possible if your reduction is made of cues. But the music needs to be quite simple, and it really limits the writing possibilities! Just for fun:

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On more than one occasion I have been called by the librarian of the Dutch national opera in a mild panic because the composer of a newly commissioned piece had assumed that “pasting an entire orchestra into two staves” constituted a piano reduction, but they needed something actually usable for the rapidly approaching rehearsals. Except for the simplest of SATB scores (like Charles’ example), a piano reduction does not have a direct correspondence to the original parts. Making a functional piano reduction of an orchestral piece requires knowledge of orchestration and of piano technique, creativity and taste. For the same reason I feel that the Paste Special > Reduce function should come with the disclaimer that it lacks any of the above.

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You mean, users should… well.. know what they are doing? What a formidable challenge! :joy:

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Oh, I understand what you are saying and I do very much agree. But let’s just use a simple example of a 4 part choral work that has frequent divisi of these four parts and we are using the Reduction tool to condense into a piano grand staff for rehearsal. Let’s add that the divisi occurs frequently and there are a fair number of shorter duration pitches that change almost note to note. The composer decides to alter a few notes in Alto 2, Soprano 1, Tenor 2 and Bass 1. Some of the changes overlap these voices but some of the changes are made within a short time frame of the music but not necessarily successively. Now, I always verify my notation entries but, being human, especially under a tight time constraint, I miss a single Tenor 2, 16th note (semiquaver) in the piano reduction. When this is brought to my attention, I am mortified at my oversight. It also dawns on me that in this technological age, it would seem that it could be feasible to ensure that a change in the parts results in a change in the reduction. It would be a nice tool to have…

:rofl: :joy: :rofl: Funny…

The ability to ‘mirror’ existing staves has already been requested – like the similar function in Finale which never worked properly and was eventually removed. So presumably mirroring staves into voices would come after that.

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Yes as “aliasing” but with a slightly different approach to support its use. Thanks for sharing. That was a couple of years ago so I thought it would be OK to address this again though from slightly different perspective.

Oh, and linked parts in Finale continued on through the final version 27.4 and I did use it from time to time with reasonable success.

Thanks for your input!

I was talking about the Mirror Tool, not Linked parts.

@sjanssens “Arrrrrggggggg”, indeed. I haven’t coded software in about a decade since I let my creative brain overtake my logical brain but I would definitely agree with you on this point. Finale has moderate success with this but I haven’t a clue how it was coded. I’m sure the Dorico programmers are significantly more enlightened and up to date than I would be to tackle such a request. I can only envision dozens of layers of nested code - that just makes my head hurt! :joy:

@benwiggy OK. My bad for assuming it would be the same type of process. Peace.

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Nifty! So you did this using shift+u functionality? Or condensing?

Shift+U, only, no condensing. And some settings in Notation and Engraving options, as well as in Properties Panel, in order to have cues that don’t look like cues :slight_smile:

Have a look if you wish:
Reduction in cues.dorico (441,2 Ko)

Very interesting. How, exactly, do you get, for example, cues for Soprano and Alto into the single treble staff of the grand staff? I understand using Properties to change stem direction. I’m still somewhat new with using cues (just 10 months of Dorico use).

Unless I’m mistaken, you can’t directly input two cues from different instruments in the same bar. But you can, for example, input the Soprano cue in bar 1 and the Alto cue in bar 2. Then, cues have small handles on each side, and you can extend them as far as you like, to the right and/or to the left. That way, they will overlap.

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I use cues to reduce 4-part choral passages - but it doesn’t work well if there are divisi as there is no combining of notes onto shared stems.

For simple material, though, it works remarkably well.

Maybe in a while there will be an AI assistant capable of creating proper piano reductions….

I sense many of our tools should be labeled ‘just because you can doesn’t necessarily mean you should.’

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Thanks for the detail.

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