Having trouble saving noteheads as default

I’m trying to correct the appearance of whole note harmonics.
I selected the right diamonds, placing them correctly, one for up-stem, the other for down-stem.

everything looks perfect.

The little star for my “white diamond noteheads” is all white. Which I presume means it is set as default, right?

I tried clicking on it, then click on it again. it goes grey, then back to white when I click again.

But if I start a new document, it still has the old settings for diamond noteheads.

Am I doing something wrong? Maybe forgetting a step?
How do I save my diamond noteheads so they will be usable in other documents?

Oh, and when I save as a new notehead set, the diamonds are now in new documents… but the placement of the diamonds is wrong!

this is the set I created with the right placement of diamond noteheads

And this is a new document from scratch, with the incorrect placement of diamonds (it’s a minor difference, but still, there shouldn’t be ANY difference, right?)
(the Bb at the end is too far to the left)

Please do Help > Create Diagnostic Report and attach the resulting zip file here. The zip file will include your user library XML file, so I can see what is saved in there.

Dorico Diagnostics.zip (737.6 KB)

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Your own notehead is called White diamond notehead harmonics, but Dorico will only use the built-in White diamond noteheads notehead set for its automatic harmonics. Either you need to edit that built-in notehead set, or not use the automatic harmonics feature, instead creating the harmonics as regular notes and then overriding their notehead.

I ended up creating the new notehead category because I wasn’t getting any results from the white diamond noteheads category.

I tried editing the White Diamond Noteheads in a document, to get the exact placement and the right shape I wanted for whole notes (the default whole note harmonic is completely wrong.)

Then I tried saving this as default.

But when I tried a new blank document my white diamond noteheads weren’t there. it was the default one, with faulty placement and faulty notehead.

is there any way to see what glyph is being used?

I’m seeing a very slight difference between the harmonic diamond that was already there under “White Diamond Noteheads” and the one I created. I went looking for the same glyph, but once it was inserted, somehow, it looks every so slightly larger.

Trying to scroll through all the names of SMuFL glyphs and names of categories is a veritable nightmare.

It would be hand to be able to mouse over a glyph and see it’s exact name.

OK, I’ve deleted the “White Diamond Notehead Harmonics” category that I had created.

I created a new blank document using the string orchestra template.
From which I deleted the Harmonics. I opened a new blank document, again using the string orchestra template. All is good, the Harmonics category is gone.

Now, my adjusted harmonics are NOT present, however, in the “White Diamond Notehead” category.

So I recreated them. I added some to that document to test them, they work fine, they look good. I saved that document (just in case the document has to be saved for anything to stick.)

I opened a new document, same thing, string template, blank.

I insert the same notes, assign harmonics to all of them… and… nope, no luck, the wrong glyphs, the wrong placement.

And when I go to notehead sets, the White Diamond notehead group does NOT contain my changes.

here is a diagnostics report from both files, one has the wrong noteheads, the other has the correct one that don’t seem to apply to other files.
Dorico Diagnostics WRONG.zip (716.8 KB)
Dorico Diagnostics.zip (722.7 KB)

this would be a lot easier if Dorico didn’t use two contrasting noteheads for stemmed and non-stemmed harmonics.

I’m very curious what lead to the decision to use two different glyphs to represent harmonics? they should be identical.

If you want your non-stemmed noteheads to be centred rather than attached to a non-invisible stem, but you want your stemmed noteheads attached to the stem, do you not need two different noteheads?

(And if you don’t like the contrasting noteheads, note that you can change it yourself.)

no, the problem isn’t the noteheads themselves, it’s what is being used for harmonics.

the default harmonic glyph for whole notes in Dorico is this tiny, lopsided diamond that is radically different from the harmonic glyph used for stemmed notes.

I want (require) all harmonics to use the same glyph, whether they are stem-attached or not. The horizontal placement will be different for up-stem/down-stem whole notes so that the harmonic is actually properly centered above the actual note.

For stemmed notes, Dorico does it ok.

The issue is with non-stemmed notes (see the examples in my post above, where I modified the harmonic for whole notes).

As I said, Dorico’s default glyph for whole note harmonics is a VERY different glyph from that used for stemmed harmonics: it leans in the opposite direction, is about 75% smaller, and has different thickness and curvature inside its lines.

Given that harmonic noteheads are noteheads, it is the noteheads themselves that are the problem.

I’m not sure there’s any point in rehashing a topic that’s been done many times previously. You yourself participated in this thread last year, and it basically has all of the answers to your questions.

well, it doesn’t because I can’t create a set of noteheads for my harmonics that actually gets registered as the default notehead set.

right now, my issue is that I create the right look noteheads, they work in whatever document I created them in. But they don’t seem to get registered as the “save as default”.

I have to recreate them with every new document.

Daniel explained where you’re going wrong further up this thread.

In your text below, there’s no mention of saving the changes as default:

I don’t mean to sound impatient or difficult, but I know it’s possible to save altered harmonics as default, using the instructions posted a whole bunch of times on this forum, as I’ve done so myself and used them successfully in many projects.

Ok, go ahead, explain how easy it is.

I first changed the noteheads in the ordinary White Diamond noteheads category.

Everything looked great.

but there’s no way to “save as default”.

The little star is white.
Clicking it to make it grey, then again to make it white, does nothing. Nada, Rien.

Nothing tells you whether or not you have actually saved as default.

And the proof that it did NOT save as default is that opening a new blank document does not have my changes in it.

I started by ONLY changing the harmonic notehead glyph in the default White Diamond notehead set.

Since that wasn’t working, I much later tried making a new notehead set only for harmonics. To which Daniel responded with the news that that wouldn’t work since Dorico ONLY looks in the default White Diamond Noteheads category.

Let me simplify the issue, since it’s getting mired in cross-talk.

I made changes to notehead set White Diamond Notehead.

The little star for each notehead is white.
The little star for the entire category “White Diamond Notehead” is white.

Is this, or is this not then saved as default?

Because no matter what I do to those little stars, my notehead set is NOT saved as default.

For example, I created a diamond notehead that is spaced a certain way for stem up.

When I open a new blank document, that notehead is not present in White Diamond Notehead.

What do I have to do to have it save as default?

Having calmed down somewhat after a night’s sleep…

I was able to (finally) have the default “White Diamond Noteheads” reflect the three noteheads I needed: one for stemmed notes, and one each for up and down stem whole notes.

I deleted everything in the “White Diamond Noteheads” category, and started from scratch.

But I still have an issue.

While the three noteheads I created are there, the fine-tuning I did to those noteheads is absent when I open a new document.

For example, I want the diamond noteheads to be at 90%, which gives a more balanced, pleasing appearance.

I also displaced the noteheads, one by +1.5 the oither by -1.5, which gave me a centered harmonic (using the trick that was given in another thread of adding a (basically) invisible “.” text character after the harmonic.

But again, this displacement doesn’t seem to stick. In a new document, all those settings are back to the default: no resizing, and no horizontal displacement.

Is there a setting I’m forgetting to check that will save those adjustments?

(by the way I had a HELL of a time finding the correct white diamond notehead for my harmonics. it was in the last place I would have thought of looking: Medieval Noteheads. At least now I know!)

The medieval notehead set utilises some of the same noteheads, but something’s awry if that’s the only place you can find it. I think you’ve not quite understood that the same notehead can be used in multiple notehead sets.

I’ll try to take a closer look when I’m back in front of a computer later today.

I just made a video that hopefully clears some of this up: