Hey Manike, did this change with Cubase Pro 10? I recently switched from Logic and seeing these automation lines scattered throughout a large project is maddening. Thanks for the tip about locking the track, at least I’m not accidentally creating automation points - but still…
Is there still a way to hide these automation lines outside of hiding the tracks (which I def don’t want to do)? Seeing these lines makes absolutely no sense, I’ll do a key command if I want to view automation.
Thanks
So I just discovered - if there’s no automation data and you lock the track, the lines disappear (yay), but if there is data and lock the track, lines stay BUT at least I won’t be accidentally creating automation.
Thanks for the lock tip - I’ll def submit a Feature Request for this one.
Change volume to mute automation track and you will never break it by accidental clicking.
Thanks for this! This has been bugging me for years and now I found this workaround…
thanks king
op’s option should be in cubase as well also
The group tracks are still showing the volume automation line many years later!
Complications with the volume automation line for group tracks:
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This volume line can be hidden by clicking the lock button, but not only does this add one extra step, it still does not hide the volume automation when there is currently used automation
The automation line shows as soon as you add a group track, even when there is no need to automate it
Cluttered workflow
When deselecting audio or midi tracks, we need to click on an empty area of the screen. We then sometimes accidentally click on the group volume automation lines, which causes the volume on that group track to change. Undoing this action does not undo the volume change that was accidentally made to the group track. This forces us to always lock the group track
Even when we have no intention on changing volume automation for group tracks, we are still forced to look at an automation line if we don’t keep locking the track
As we move our cursor across the project area, the mouse changes to the draw tool when near group track volume automation lines, even when we do not wish to make automation. This of course only happens when the track is not locked
The moral of the story is we always need to keep the groups tracks locked to prevent a clutter and to prevent accidents. This adds one extra step, and still does not hide the volume automation when there is automation drawn. Just like all other tracks, the group track’s volume automation lane should appear upon clicking the “show/hide automation” button. This would allow for a cleaner and less cluttered workflow and would prevent accidental automation changes that can not be undone.
Yes… that’s correct
more than 30.000 Cubase users out there and only 10 complaining about that… it must be high priority
I have no problem with the automation lanes in group tracks and only use them from time to time!
You even said so yourself that you only use them from time to time so therefore this automation line in the group tracks is pointless. Also you probably don’t use group tracks as much as other folks do because if you did you would be complaining. Very few people are going to take the time to post on here about these problems, so 10 people is actually a lot, and this is not the only post I’ve seen about this topic.
st10ss,
You seem to keep replying to my comments around this website with rude and unhelpful information; it is time you make some adjustments. Let’s keep things friendly next time
I was trying to make the point that I use groups very often and I don’t care about the automation lane showing in the group tracks.
I still agree, they’re a pain in the ass.
I get why folks might not want to see the Automation Lane for Groups in the Project Window.
What I don’t understand is why do those same folks want to display Groups in the Project Window at all. I’m probably missing something super obvious, but the only reason I ever make Group Tracks visible in the Project Window is to look at their Automation Lanes.
That’s very interesting that you don’t need to look at group/fx tracks in the project window. Looking at group tracks in the project window is literally what I do almost every minute of mixing music. We must have completely different work flows, or we are doing completely different things.
Here is an in-depth explanation of why I’m constantly looking at group tracks:
Here is a screenshot of my work flow:
The “lead” folder shows all the tracks that make up that particular sound. These tracks are Layered to make up this one “Lead” sound. synth bass 1 and bass 2 are tweaked, then outputted to group track “bass 1 & 2” so that I can apply processing to both tracks together, and so I can adjust volume for the both of them together for easier blending.
“Top” is the high frequencies of the Lead I am making, and “Mid” is the mid frequencies of the lead. Once these are perfected, I want to apply reverb, volume pumping effect (with lfo tool) to BOTH the “top” and “mid” tracks together. So I output “top” and “mid” to the group track named “top & mid”, and now I can apply processing to the both of them combined. Now I want to create reverb for these tracks, but I want to be able to make EQ adjustment to the reverb using plugins without affecting the original dry signal, and I also want to side chain compress the reverb track using the dry track as the trigger. To do this, I create a group track and add the reverb to it, now I can apply processing to just the reverb without effecting the original signal. Now I want to adjust the volume of top & mid & reverb together so I can properly blend it in the song, so I output “top”, “mid”, and “reverb” to a group track called “top & mid & reverb”. Now I can apply processing and volume adjustments to all of those tracks at the same time.
I can’t understand how people are mixing without doing things like this lol, can you explain your work flow?
Notice the group track volume automation lines just sitting there doing nothing but cluttering up the project window lol. I have automation on those group tracks, so I’m forced to look at the automation even after locking the track, even though I may not need to make adjustments ever again to the group track volume, so then I just end up staring at these lines over the next few months while I work on the track. Why have automation tracks hidden for ALL parameters except volume? The volume should be in the sub-automation lanes just like all other automation is. Makes no sense to have automation shown in two different locations.
Exactly!
Well I am doing routing & processing similar to what you describe, but a lot of that work I do from the MixConsole and not the Project Window.
Most of the work I do in the Project Window is related to timing specific items - e.g. the bass Part starts at a specific time, an automation change occurs at specific time, the progression changes to a IV at a specific time. So creating and editing things like that are primarily what I’m doing in the Project Window.
Where in the MixConsole the work is more about signal flow and processing. So reverbs, EQ, levels, routing, delays, compressors, etc.
To over-simplify the Project Window is focused on ‘when’ and the MixConsole is focused on ‘what’
In general I keep all my Groups together locked to the right side and not intermingled with whatever is feeding them. The right side of my MixConsole goes - Groups | FXs | Stereo Out - and none of these are normally visible in the Project Window (except when I want to edit automation on them). I find having all the Group Channels adjacent in the MixConsole makes mixing much easier than hunting around through a bunch of tracks.
My Template does have one case of a Group Channel next to what is feeding it. I use BFD3 a lot and it has separate audio outs for kick, snare, overheads etc. So I use a Group to sum those and to my thinking it is behaving more like a main output for BFD3. But even then it is set to only be visible in the MixConsole and not in the Project Window where it serves no purpose.
Take the workflow you describe and show in your pics, if you go into the Project Window’s Left Zone and set the Group in you pic to not be visible, how does that impact your workflow? Does anything really change one way or the other based on its visibility? If not, that’s how you get rid of seeing that annoying automation line.
If you go into the Project Window’s Left Zone and set the Group in you pic to not be visible, how does that impact your workflow?
I never use the mix console because it doesn’t allow me to easily tell which group tracks are for which synth. If I put the group tracks right below the synth tracks on the project window, then I know all the tracks directly below that synth in the same folder are pertaining to the same synth, easy. If I started to hide the group tracks, I wouldn’t be able to mix music with my workflow. My only option right now is to lock/unlock each group track as I go along
Interesting work flow you have though, I had no idea people were using the mix console to that degree. For large projects, it would be interesting to watch how you quickly locate a group track when everything isn’t all neatly grouped together in folders in the project window
If I do just mixing stuff than I have them visible for overview…
If I do editing it depends on the situation…
Interesting work flow you have though, I had no idea people were using the mix console to that degree. For large projects, it would be interesting to watch how you quickly locate a group track when everything isn’t all neatly grouped together in folders in the project window
That’s what it made for…
all my Groups have the same colour so I can find them easily in the mix console…
another possibility would be to use a second mix console window with just groups and FX
all my Groups have the same colour so I can find them easily in the mix console
I see that you can easily find your group tracks in the mix console because you have all of them the same color, but when you have 20 group track outputs/sends, how do you tell which group track is for which sound?
Basically I use Group Tracks to create a cascading series of sub-mixes that eventually all come together at Stereo Out. Most of the time I’m routing multiple signals to a group and not using a Group for a single instrument (although on occasion I might in order to get a specific result).
I’ve attached a screenshot of the MixConsole from my current Project which is still in the writing stage. Most likely it will gain some additional routing and Group Tracks when it moves to the mixing stage. Also this is stretched out over 2 monitor screens so it is all visible in the pic with no scrollbar (you’ll need zoom in to read stuff - well at least with my eyes).
So the Groups are pinned to the right and thus always visible and the normal Audio & Instruments are in the middle with the Inputs pinned to the left (hidden in this pic). The red shows all the ‘guitar’ Tracks which is routed to the Guitar Group which in turn is routed to the Rhythm Section Group that then goes to Stereo Out. You can see something similar in green for Vocals. Also on the far left you can see what is usually the lone Group Track in the middle which consolidates the BFD3 outputs.
In general sound moves from left to right.
I color Tracks based on instrument/musical-purpose which makes it pretty easy to match Group & Source Tracks. Additionally the routing is easy to see looking at the Direct Routing matrix. Also notice that middle and right sections kinda mirror each other. The Vocals Group and the vocal Tracks are closest to the middle/right boundary, guitars are next out from that, etc. Originally I had these match with the vocal Group & Tracks being furthest right, guitars next furthest right - but for some reason I find mirroring them easier 
. Either way most of the time I can scroll the middle section so the source Tracks are visually close to their Group Tracks
Using a setup like this I can often do a final mix just using a handful of Group Tracks that are all adjacent to each other (which the X-Touch appreciates).
I suppose I’m predisposed to this type of workflow since I came up on mag tape and physical mixers where this would have been a typical approach.