Hiding Elements

yup I know, but then Hide/Show Item doesn’t hide items like noteheads, or slurs or etc etc

it’s very simple - we need a context-aware command that hides what is currently selected.

As I said before, I can’t understand the resistance to this - all this talk of ‘The Dorico Way’ is seriously woo-woo

if you think that, probably you didn’t spend enough time in the Forum yet… :slightly_smiling_face:

[EDIT: removed the not quite appropriate part of my post)]

By the way, the philosophy and concept that are at the basis of Dorico are well described in the Manual:

yup, I know, but typically I want to get them all correct before I hide them.

To be clear I don’t personally have a problem with the way that time signatures are hidden, I was just using that as an example of the inconsistency with which Dorico handles hiding things in the jump bar.

I perfectly understand your point of view. As a day-1 user, I have been following how “hiding stuff” has been a long story in Dorico’s development. Daniel stated many times it was not the way they wanted things to be (hidden or shown).
But as time went by, more and more objects gained “hidebility”. And now, we users have a number of ways to hide different things instead of one simple button.
It would now require some revamping of many things to simplify this for the new user who doesn’t want to cope with that variety of ways to hide stuff. And this is where we are now :person_shrugging:

Unfortunately, for the record, I find this doesn’t work with every thing. There’s several items which are hideable in the bottom panel, where this key command doesn’t work, which I find both confusing and frustrating – so I often don’t even use it.

I don’t understand very well (I am not at home, so I can’t verify that) :
Do you mean that the ‘H’ key shown by Christian doesn’t always work on every element ?

I hope you read my full post too though, to understand I offered you several solutions to obtain your goal if it’s something you feel you need to do a lot. As otherwise mentioned I don’t care what your reason is which I don’t mean as an offensive comment, but rather a vote of support in the bigger picture of allowing users to create their own path that works for them. So if you want to hide time sigs, I say go for it, you do you!

Regarding beams, also look at assigning a key command to split beam. I use this all day every day to split where Dorico has autobeamed. With one note selected it will split the auto beam at that point, or with all notes in a beam selected it will split each of them entirely.

I presume if that’s something you’re trying to do a lot, it would probably be more helpful than hiding time signatures. But again, I want to re-iterate, I’m here to offer you a helping hand with these suggestions, and I fear I have spent unnecessary time on this.

As far as I can tell, if hiding it will make a signpost, you can use hide/show item

Yes, that’s correct. I can’t recall everything off the top of my head, but I know text dynamics which are hideable, will not respond to that key command (so I created my own using a macro - but still!). Also I have just checked, harp pedals cannot be hidden with this command. I’m sure there are plenty more.

I think you misunderstood my post, or I wasn’t clear enough. I wasn’t looking for specific solutions - I use all of these work-arounds daily. I was simply adding further examples of Dorico’s inconsistency in the way in which it hides things.

probably because Dorico needs to know what you want to hide in a note: notehead?, stem?, ledger line?, accidental?.. All these you can reach from the Properties panel or with easy to remember aliases/shortucts from the Jump bar (for hide ledger lines you can record a macro in 5 seconds and reach for it with jhll). In your approach you want to select an item and have a global shortcut, in Dorico you select the note and choose through the shortcut what to hide on its appearance, so you choose the note and all what has to do with it is hiddable, instead of having to select different items with the mouse to hide them:

You could also record a macro to have hide all (for the mentioned items that has to do with a note):

You did say that you cannot access “hide time signature” from the jump bar and a key command, and I literally showed you how to do that… If that is a workaround you already knew and used, that was not clear.

and I agree the hiding could be more open-ended to the user.

exactly, and context aware

consider MuseScore:

  • I want to hide the stem I click it and press v
  • I want to hide the flag on the stem I click it and press v
  • I want to hide the dot I click it and press v
  • I want to hide the accidental I click on it and press v
  • I want to hide all of the above, plus any stray ledger lines I click the notehead and press v
  • I decide I want to keep just the dot visible for some reason - see above and ctrl-click the dot and press v
  • I want to do any of the above for a selection of notes, including the beams, I marquee them or shift-click or ctrl-click and press v
  • Hide a dynamic - yup, select and v
  • Hide an articulation, playing technique, bracket, clef, time signature, text, beam, tempo indication, line, barline…let me think, it’s select and v
  • make anything visible again - that’ll be v

Are you seriously saying that if you could hide and unhide things like this, you wouldn’t?

What I want to hide is what I have selected. It’s that simple.

If you think so, it must be.

Wow, once again I am completely blown away. When I read this whole discussion, I realized as a long-time Dorico user (Dorico 1) how much the use of a software shapes your thinking. The very simple question from @Damian_leGassick of whether there could be a simple keyboard shortcut for hiding objects almost turned into a philosophical discussion in which even “Bauhaus” was mentioned. Although I love Dorico, @Damian_leGassick actually speaks from my heart. Why shouldn’t it be possible to hide objects with a simple key command? It is obviously possible with rests. It is an annoying interruption in my workflow when I have to take the mouse in my hand to hide something (moreover, I have to show the bottom panel first and get there with the mouse) or I have to call up the jump bar and then type some letters. I am aware that problems can also arise (how can it be clear which part of a note (for example: stem, flag, note head) should be hidden?), but with Dorico it is actually possible to define keyboard commands that include multiple strokes. Despite the many posts, it remains a valid question why so many more actions (jump bar etc.) or so much time must be used to solve this simple task of hiding. Even though I am really enthusiastic about Dorico, there are unfortunately areas that have been solved significantly inferior to all other applications (deceased or not). But with this great team in the background of this software, you can make hopefully such criticism or requests at any time without being drawn into a fundamental discussion.

Just a quick question : in his post yesterday, Christian shows the shortcut preferences in which the letter H appears as a shortcut for the Hide command. You all seem to be familiar with this shortcut.
However, I’ve looked through the online help, as well as the Quick reference card (PDF) and other help-memory documents designed by Steinberg : nowhere is there any mention of this shortcut… Have I looked the wrong way?

No, it’s a custom shortcut that Christian has created.

Ah… I understand now. I was afraid not to be able to search in the Dorico help, although quite well done. :slightly_smiling_face: