How to tie a chord before a repeat end sign to the chord at the beginning of a repeat bar? it’s an 8 bar section where the beginning repeat sign has a chord that starts before it and ties over it. The end repeat has the same chord before it which ties back to the chord at the beginning of the repeat. Dorico seems to ignore repeat end signs with notes before it that tie back to the beginning of the repeat section.
Welcome to the forum, Herbie (and a particularly warm welcome if you are Herbie).
This doesn’t yet exist as a real semantic function, but you can cheat it with an l.v. tie, found in the properties panel. Once you’ve turned on the lv tie property for the tied-into note at the start of the repeat section, you’ll want to switch to Engrave mode (assuming you’re using Dorico Pro), select each of the tie endpoints and nudge them back so that the tie appears before the note. I tend to use Cmd/Ctrl-Alt-Left for this, but a mouse works too.
But I need to have the chord at the end of the 8 bars tie to the same chord which is at the beginning of the 8 bars.
You’re not going to get playback to work.
You can make it look right by giving turning on the lv tie property for both the chord at the start and the chord at the end, then tweaking the lv tie at the start so that it appears before rather than after the chord.
The chord at the beginning of the 8 bars is already tied to the chord before the beginning repeat sign. That one is already okay. I tried your suggestion on the chord just before the end repeat sign and it worked. It’s crude but it works (sort of). The lv tie at the end looks like it’s tied to the chord at the beginning of the repeated section, which is what I wanted. Thanks for the suggestion. (Yes, I’m Herbie.)
Hi Herbie - yes should do, here’s a quick example:
That’s an lv tie at the end of the first ending, whose length has been adjusted in Engrave mode.
Yes. I did that but Dorico won’t play this back properly because an lv tie is just cosmetics applied to this situation and, it’s my understanding, not the true purpose of an lv tie. Dorico does so many things so well I’m surprised that it won’t do this simple thing properly!
At the moment that’s right, as Leo mentioned earlier in the thread - it’s not a built-in feature yet as there’s all kinds of things that need to be considered in relation to first/second time endings (dynamics, playing techniques etc). It’s on the team’s radar to implement comprehensively, e.g.
Thank you for explaining that it’s difficult to do and hasn’t been solved yet. Actually my real use is for a 5 note chord in the treble clef which requires 5 lv ties. The lv ties are difficult to maneuver to their proper place because Engrave mode has each one in 4 different moveable segments.
Funnily enough I was engraving something fairly recently that involved lots of lv ties in the same chord and got a bit bored of adjusting all the separate handles too - I ended up making a custom playing technique that looks like an lv tie of the right length and dimensions, and added multiple techniques that I then moved to the right graphical position in Engrave mode - some needed to be at different rhythmic positions to minimise the impact on staff spacing, although there are other options around that.
I tried using a regular tie, tied to a half note C in a different voice with hidden stem and an hidden note head. You need to create a hidden note head though, or scale it to 1% in the properties panel.
Test.dorico (386.7 KB)
You can also just use the Properties panel to adjust the Start and End offsets and then Dorico will adjust them symmetrically, rather than deal with all the tiny handles.
Improved version with a 5 note chord.
Test.dorico (388.0 KB)
In Engraving Options > Ties > Length, you can set a minimum length for lv ties. This gives you a global setting that will make all of them look better for your situation.
I thought one occasional solution to this “tied-over” problem might be to lengthen the playback length. But when I follow the instructions here I cannot seem to lengthen the playback without lengthening the notated value at the same time in spite of the icon I choose in the left column.
(Of course it doesn’t work anyway if the instrument at the start of the repeat has any articulation at all, but I would still like to know how to extend the sound of a note without adjusting its written value.)
Those pages are lacking in screenshots of the relevant buttons, but as long as Played Durations is selected, changing the played duration shouldn’t affect the notated duration. If you have a project where that’s not the case, share it with steps needed to produce the problem.
I entered the notes in a test file.
In Play, I chose the Playback icon at the left.
I selected the shape of the note I wanted to extend.
I used SHIFT+ALT+Right Arrow to lengthen the shape, and it lengthened.
I went back to Write and found the length of my extended note had eaten into the first note of the next measure.
I also added an empty measure to the end of the file and tried lengthening just the playback of the final note; but again, when I checked Write mode, the notation had lengthened as well.
I supposed I should be able to alter the playback length of a note regardless of what was in the next measure.
extendPlaybackLength.dorico (432.0 KB)
Shift-Alt/Opt-Right arrow is the key command for lengthening notes.
See here for the instructions for changing the played duration - it doesn’t reference the key command, just clicking and dragging, for that reason.
Thank you. That worked. For some reason I had not seen the arrow when I tried to drag in the past, but it is indeed there.