HSSE3 & HS7 - difference in project length

Can someone explain, why the project made from Classical Orchestra template and used HALion Sonic SE 3.5 is 2,8 MB of size, but opened with HALion Sonic 7 and saved, becomes 1,5 MB?

What was wrong with HSSE if HS can offer the same functionality with half of data? I don’t want to assume that Dorico looses half of project data because of HS7 installed. Reopened it has everything in place. No problems.

Just to make sure the VST used is the only difference being looked at, are you opening and saving both the HSSE3 and HS7 projects into the same version of Dorico?

Of course! Otherwise I wouldn’t write here my observation.

Do you have this checked in Project Info? (It is by default.)

If so, your file size will have some large swings as what’s in view when the preview is saved will affect the file size too.

(I hate this and wish there was a Preferences setting to default to having this off rather than on.)

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Look - I didn’t change anything. Just installed Halion Sonic 7, open project saved before installation of HS7, then save with new filename. Didn’t touch anything in preferences.

Then you have a preview saved with your file so you’ll get lots of variance in file size depending on what is saved in the preview.

I will repeat - I didn’t change any setting. So if there was “generate preview” active before installation of HS7, then it’s active after installation.

I tried with other files where used Halion Sonic SE 3. The same. Differs not by half, but anyway, with HS7 project file is smaller than with HSSE3 (I mean latest version - v3.5).

Then I’ll repeat as well - if you have the “have Dorico randomize my file size” feature still selected, then you are going to have random file sizes. First step is to turn that off.

I seriously doubt this is accounting for all the discrepancy in file size you are seeing, but until you turn that off, your file size is not necessarily directly related to the content in your project.

Another observation!
Opened the same project and not going to open Halion Sonic 7 GUI. Just simply open and save with new name. Then new file size differs only by 200 KB.
Then opened the same project and going to open HS7 and doing nothing in there and close GUI, then save with new name. The file size differs by 1,3 MB.

I’m still waiting for explanation. I guess that HS7 on open fix and clean it’s kitchen and organize preset in memory differently. I just want to know is it accidentally or programmed specially, but not told publicly, that HS7 does this that way.

@FredGUnn, I really don’t understand your randomized thoughts :smiley: Maybe you ran out of beer tonight? :smiley:

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I hate the preview thumbnail feature because when I hit save, Dorico embeds a PNG and PDF into the file, thus randomizing the file size somewhat depending on the size of these graphics files. When I forget to turn this off, it still stresses me out when I look and my manual backup file is much larger than my current working file.

I doubt this is causing all the difference you are seeing, but until you turn this off any comparison between files is unscientific because you have randomly sized graphics embedded in your files.

Okay, now I understood what you mean. But it’s the game - to polish every software by adding nice illustrations. Sometimes it took too much resources. And yes, probably it’s the best way to ask for options in preferences that allow to switch off beautifulizations, because we want to work, not enjoy a lounge with Dorico.

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BTW, I’ve checked the same in Cubase.

Please, @dspreadbury, invite someone from Cubase team to join this discussion. I don’t want to duplicate this in Cubase forum, because I started here. Main questions at the end of post.
Here is new observation:

I loaded old project (template) made in Cubase 11 using Halion Sonic SE 3.5. The project made as template for full Halion Symphony Orchestra - it means that the project hase more than 100 tracks. Each track has indivudual HSO plugin and preset loaded.

So, this project (Cubase 11 & HSSE 3.5) was 20 MB big.

Okay, now I load it in Cubase 12 with Halion Sonic 7 installed. Loaded and saved - the project file weighs the same 20 MB, but some 15 KB less.

Then I go through every track, open its GUI - the Halion Sonic 7 smoothly opens like individual plugin (w/o multichannel possibilities), I don’t change anything, just close GUI and do the same on every next track until all 109 HSO tracks open/closed. Then I disable all tracks and… Wow! … the size of project is 15 MB.

So the questions are:

  1. What HS7 does differently if data block for each instance is smaller?
  2. Is it safe to use HS7? I mean does HS7 store preset block more correctly than HSSE did if the size can reach twice as low?

I suspect there was some optimization of file format that we customers are not privy to.

Sure! This optimization probably lock the project to current version and we don’t have backward compatibility. Of course better is to look forward, but not only my experience with Steinberg products pushes me sometimes step back to finish job.

Okay, I have good desktop computer as main computer in studio but all my researching made on laptop (it isn’t that old to throw it out). But anyway there was no mentioning about such optimization you mentioned. I didn’t read anywhere that. Did you read?

I had many times in my experience that something was modified in project and saved, then because of crashes I step back to previous version and the project could not be opened as before (it has presets changed/optimized and so on). In this case it is Halion version, but the fear is the same. And Halion Sonic 7 requires more resources than HSSE and I have reach many crashes since HS7 installed.

It’s only a guess on my part.

I will ask my colleagues in the HALion team about this, and report back as and when I have an answer from them.

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