Hello,
I just upgraded my Cubase Artist to V13.0.20 because I am very interrested in Iconica Sketch
but I have some problems on some instruments upper range.
Some notes do not play although I was expecting them:
Horns doesn’t sound above D4
Bassoons stops also at C4
Trombones stops at Bb3
Is there a solution, or is it a limitation concerning Iconica Sketch?
Thanks for your help
My guess is that is the real range of those instruments. Most orchestral libraries only cover the range of an instrument unlike GM midi modules where everything is full range but probably one sample.
If you open the keyboard in Halion VST you see the range of the instrument reflecting of the white keys, the grey ones are out of range.
Yes this is ok to check the range but this doesn’t allow to retreive the missing notes which shouldn’t be out of range.
These appear to be general standard ranges. There are a number of variations in the type and manufacture of instruments as well as the ability of different performers.
For example: The highest note in Iconica Sketch for a bassoon is C4 (listen to the opening of the Rite of Spring). My bassoon has a high-D key but I can only get up to high Bb on a good day.
Hoi Alain,
I noticed this a while ago.
For classical work this is a big thing.
Never saw a reaction from Steinberg on this issue.
Maybe I am going to ask the question to Steinberg support.
Sadly, they won’t be able to give you any good news…
I’ve read elsewhere (Dorico forum) that the sounds in this library are what they are - the instrument ranges captured are bound by the recordings (samples) made on the day. Any (expected) notes outside certain ranges for certain instruments simply don’t exist.!
You will need to find other means to ‘substitute’ for your desired ‘missing’ notes from another source. For example, perhaps the HALion Symphonic Orchestra may offer possibilities, that can be massaged to ‘fit’ in so they trick the ear, to blend with your composition.
I’m unsure, but would suspect, that the full ‘Iconica Sections and Players’ library won’t offer any more scope.
Might be worth a double-check on that - I could be wrong… 
Good luck.!
You know, I had the same reaction at first, but then I thought that maybe Steinberg’s trying to promote/suggest more “humane” orchestration?
After all, I can’t hit a reliable high C on trombone. (Every day, waking up at 3 am on my way to the bathroom, pianissimo, fortissimo, whateverissimo)
“You’re not a pro then.” I know that already. But if we define a pro trombonist as “the one that can at any time produce a beautiful high F (and can probably play up to the Bb above that, but don’t dare you consider it as usable range)” suddenly the world is filled with bass trombonist with a crappy low register.
“Why can’t this point guard dunk? Are they pros, or not?” is a similar question or “Why can’t this defender run up and down the wing all the time, running 16kms each game?” is similar.
So, yes, ok, there are occurences of high register in music. But are those exceptions, or have they become the rule? Should a sample library offer the high D of the flute? It’s surely there in a prokofiev transcription of a violin concerto I think. How about the low B? There’s a B foot available since always.
I don’t know, it’s an innocent question at the face of it, but it’s complicated for me. As I said, seeing that the french horn wouldn’t go above its A was surprising, but then I thought “So, George, is your artistic vision so weak as to completely depend on a pretty iffy Bb of one instrument? Have you exhausted all other solutions when it comes to orchestrating this part? Do you think an easier part could serve the music better, since more players could play it easily? Or do you just want to strike terror to the heart of many just to reinstate the wonderful capacity and virtuosity of some select few?”
So… In the end I think the ranges are ok. Could there be 3 more notes on the top? There could. Is it certain that those notes are always there, day in and day out, and after 4 hours of playing. Not for most players that I know.
Hi ggmanestraki,
I disagree.
If you work on a symfonie from Mahler and the notes are not available in
Iconica Opus… I think Mahler knows what he is writing!
Of course Mahler knew. As did anyone whose works we enjoy today. The point I’m trying to discover is if this is “standard range” that all products on the market should satisfy, no ifs or buts, or if it’s open to discussion.
There are many libraries after all. Should all of them cover the exact same range? And if yes, WHAT is this standard range? A search online will quickly produce various results. One source thinks trumpets should go up to C, another might offer D, another yet might offer that E is not out of the question.
That’s what I’m saying. I’m not suggesting that celebrated works are badly orchestrated, on the contrary.
Hi TwanV and ggmanestraki,
In fact I agree with both of you, for me, since I am just an amateur using Iconica for my hobby,
I don’t expect very much more, this was just for information and I found a solution using the equivalent
standard Halion instrument which honestly are very similar (maybe same samples)
But it could be that for a professionnal musician, it could help having some higher notes.
Thanks for your answers
Just got Iconica Sketch for iPad.
The problem you’re seeing is because of confusion over middle C.
Middle C should be C4 but Iconica makes it C3. This explains the apparently missing upper range on these instruments.
Apparently this issue is common. With the lowest C on the piano being referred to as C0 by some and C1 by others.
I see what you are saying, but academically, by that I mean books and not Wikipedia, there are standard ranges where a composer is expected to know the limitations of the instrument for the ‘general’ orchestral player.
A few players can go far above the instrument, in some cases, but that shouldn’t prompt library companies to start recording very high notes for the Horns for instance and the Trumpets, etc.
Maybe, an ‘expert’ section on these libraries could be the answer, but the composer should know to not go crazy with writing either too low, or too high notes.
100% agree.
Again, 100% with you.
Ah, but this knowledge goes far beyond the measuring tape of range. It’s also what to play in a register, and how. I think a 1st trumpet part consisting solely of long notes above the staff (revolving around A, B, C, never above that), but never lower than G either is a fatiguing part, especially when you combine it with great changes in dynamics. Whereas, a part playing arpeggios starting from within the staff, hitting the high notes last could be much more easy to play, even if it goes beyond the high C, especially if those high notes are of moderate length, befitting the tempo, but also supported and sustained by say the oboes or clarinets.
Again 100% agree, but you see, there are people that want to recreate the Rite for example, and they say, oh, I’m missing the rips on the Horns, I don’t have the high Ds on the trombones or the bassoon. What to tell these people?
TL;DR: I don’t know. I’m torn on this one. It’s a choice to make when recording the library. I was a bit surprised about the missing A (part) and above for Horns in F, but I didn’t even go looking for say high D on the bassoon, or high A for the clarinets.
It’s an interesting discussion nonetheless.
Well, the “what” and “how” is for those who are very knowledgeable in the complex art of orchestration. I do agree with you.
I think you are right, some notes, beyond the academically determined ranges, should be available in sound libraries. Perhaps some do?
Not sure.
Speaking of Iconica Sketch. Has anyone experiences this issue?
I didn’t get any reply in this topic, so it’s still a mystery to me.