There’s some great information here.
Whilst a little off topic: just one additional aspect to think about … does the client’s aggregator accept/discourage/reject wave files with embedded data.
Nobody has specifically requested the extra information in the axml, but I was curious about it, so I downloaded AES60 and read through it - and noticed that there are probably 50 OPTIONAL fields in the axml spec, but several fields are listed as MANDATORY, so I was just attempting to add those. The tags are directly from the aes60, but I was afraid there would be a bunch of detail or additional tags that may be required along with them. Maybe not though. I’m glad to hear that the tags are reading directly in Chrome.
In Windows 10, if you right-click on a wav file, and click “properties”, and then view the “details” tab, I see some information there. I’m wondering which meta is responsible for that - the axml? I’m not in the studio at the moment so I can’t test it right now. Just guessing.
As far as aggregators accepting, discouraging, or rejecting these tags, I’m would assume they probably don’t care, but nothing I’ve done has yet to be submitted with these tags in there - as I just started experimenting with them. The project I’ve just finished would be the first. I’m supposed to give the client the files any time now. I’m tempted to go ahead and put them in there… the tags are from the official spec. I would guess the aggregators would just ignore the tags, or overwrite them if they wanted. Nothing ends up being distributed in wav format anyway… yet.
Thanks for the information Toader. I’m sure you’re right about what AES60 says about the axml if you have the document, but afaik none of the mastering programs, or Sonoris ISRC (or Hofa afaik), add anything besides the ISRC field to the axml in the wav file. You can add an ISRC in Sonoris and look at the axml chunk in Wavelab or BWF MetaEdit, and see it’s only the ISRC field that’s in there.
The metadata you see in wav files in Windows Explorer and Mac Finder is the RIFF List INFO metadata.
You might have found something that no one else (that I know of) considered when the ISRC addition came around. Definitely worth looking into the AES60 axml mandatory field info further, I would think.
In fact, aggregators do care. Here is an example: Tunecore https://support.tunecore.com/hc/en-au/articles/115006500167-Can-I-include-embedded-metadata-in-my-audio-files-
And specifically they say: “Embedding any metadata may cause issues in delivery so please avoid embedding anything in your files”
I am aware that with another major aggregator, you are a big chance of having your client’s files bounced if they contain embedded metadata.
Oh wow! Here’s another also that says they strip all the info anyway:
Well, maybe it’s pointless for us to be doing this… hehe
FWIW, I’ve been using WaveLab to tag my WAVs with metadata for a few years now and not once have I heard of an issue from the digital distributor.
I prefer to do this for the sake of future-proofing the files and it’s easier to just tell the client that all the data is embedded rather than explain that at this time no matter what I embed they have to enter all the info in manually in most cases.
I just prefer to be thorough from the start and have yet to hear of an issue for doing so.
WaveLab makes it so easy I don’t even think about it anymore, it’s just automatic.
The customer I’m working with in this case wants both versions (with AND without metadata) - so I’ve prepared a complete set of exports for him - and he also wants many different formats as well… A HUGE collection of files/exports.
People want so many different versions and formats these days that it’s become quite a project preparing someone’s files. A batch that could do many different versions/formats, along with master section presets, naming presets, etc… would be pretty amazing…
Is dither the main problem with the multi-format output? I mean it looks like you can do different metadata presets or none. And there’s the suffix naming, and separate output folders already. The only reason I wouldn’t use the batch processor to do this is because it can only make a single file from a montage you put in the batch afaik, and I prefer to work with all the other options of the render dialog concerning montages.
As best I can tell, the Render Multi tab appears to be for rendering multiple “sources” simultaneously… for example, you could render two different montages at once. As it is currently, I don’t think it’s possible to render to multiple formats from a single montage… Maybe I’m missing something though.
What I’d love to see is something like this… Imagine instead of only a “Start” button at the lower right, if there was also a “add to cue/batch” button… when you click that, all render settings are memorized for the current montage (output folder, file type, master section presets, naming presets, basically EVERYTHING), but rendering does not yet begin. The render is just put into a cue/batch to be processed whenever you hit “Start”. Maybe the cue could be visible somewhere… Next, imagine you load a completely different master preset, naming preset, and select mp3 files instead of wav for export… Once again, press either “Start” to begin processing the cue, or “Add to batch”… then a 3rd render could be added to the cue… - maybe 16-bit files or something… then a 4th - FLAC, etc, etc. Then again, then again, then again… Each batch could have any settings we wanted… When the cue is ready, hit start, and ALL renders run in a single process. Go to dinner. Come back, and all of the renders are done!
Actually you can do all of that with renders from the montage already (PG thought of everything). Everything is memorized and processed correctly for the duration of the render based on the settings, presets, naming, format, plugin chain, src, dither, destination folder, metadata, etc. etc. present at the time the render Start button is activated. Once you press Start you can completely clear everything and start from zero if you want and start the next render, and it won’t affect the ongoing queue memorized renders processing going on in the Tasks window. The only thing pressing Start doesn’t do that you described is put the renders in a Paused or Unstarted queue (which isn’t a bad thing IMO). It’s puts them in an ACTIVE queue in the Tasks window, and uses all Cores when processing afaik. I’ve done it, and I’ll list an example when I have a chance.
And now that there are master presets in the render dialog you could just make a separate render preset for each need, and start them one after the other to the queue. Probably using variables in the sub-presets to cover all cases.
YES!!! This is exactly what I was wanting to do!!! This program just gets cooler and cooler the better I get to know it! Thanks so much Bob for bringing this to my attention. This is going to save me a ton of time!
So it seems I can load a different master section preset for each render… and then save presets as you mention for each render. Yeah, this is pretty amazing. I was trying to ask about this in another thread (Render Single and Render Multi - WaveLab - Steinberg Forums), but I probably wasn’t clear enough what I was trying to do. I guess the cue idea, and saving preset for an entire cue or group of exports would be cool, but I am so happy right now to discover that I can run multiple renders at once. Thanks again Bob!
Lastly… It seems like Wavelab is using multiple CPU for each render, but when all renders are done except for one, it seems to be only using one CPU… Is there some way to have Wavelab render multiple songs at once on different CPU within a single montage render? For example - if I want to render only 24-bit files, but render all CD tracks… Is there are way to make Wavelab render 4 songs at a time since I’ve got a 4-core processor? When doing only one render of all cd tracks, Wavelab seems to be using only about 25% of my CPU. Also, imagine I’m rendering all cd tracks once for 16-bit, and then another render for 24-bit… Wavelab is using one core for each render, but the other 2 cores are not used? Can Wavelab do 2 songs per render simultaneously for a total of 4 in order to use all of the CPU?
There are currently 2 ways to render with multiple cores:
- the batch processor
- the multi tab render mode:
C:\Users\Philippe\Documents\Pictures\2018-10-14_07-37-26.png
In all cases, this is one source file per core.
Another case, it the multi-format output: one core per file format.
But there is not yet a universal mode, where each task would have its core. But this is something I have in mind.
Thanks PG… and thanks Bob for making me aware of this feature that already exists within Wavelab! I am really happy to be able to do multiple renders at one time! This is an excellent feature that will save me a ton of time!
As far as a universal mode, glad to hear that it’s in your mind 
Would be pretty cool…
Yes, I think it’s pretty amazing. I tried doing the same thing in Cubase and Reaper a while back and came to the conclusion that Wavelab can blow them away in many situations (multiple different renders from single jobs, or simultaneous renders from multiple jobs) if you have a lot of cores and a lot of heavy processing to do, since Cubase and Reaper only seem to run one process at a time. Maybe I missed something in the Reaper render queue options or global preferences, but I don’t think so. If you set up the same multiple projects, same processing, same plugins and plugin settings, same everything, and start rendering multiple jobs or multiple different renders from single jobs, you can complete the same jobs in Wavelab in a fraction of the time than in those programs, if you’re running the many intensive processing procedures on a computer with many cores.
Add to that the intense render customization you can do from the montage, and it’s just stunning.
Maybe something’s changed in those programs since I tried it but I don’t think so.
I think you have a good policy, and I would think your files have probably gone through all the distributors.
Just one more faq answer to add to the pile though:
https://distrokid.desk.com/customer/en/portal/articles/1879967-do-i-need-to-embed-metadata-into-my-tracks-before-i-upload-
“Any prior embedded info will be disregarded by stores”
And that would include embedded ISRC.
Yeah, I realize that right now it’s pretty much all for nothing but I like to think that at some point, having these thoroughly tagged WAVs is going to be helpful, or many already has in some other cases.
If anything, it’s nice to assure clients that the files are tagged when they ask me about it, even though they’ll learn the hard way that at least for right now, they’ll be entering in all the info manually with the aggregator.
WaveLab makes it so simple to do this I just do it for all projects by default without any extra effort thanks to the metadata preset being part of my default montage template.
At this point, where clients really appreciate is for the reference mp3 files they often request and use for personal/promo use as well as the download cards that come with vinyl/cassette releases.
So … and I ask this because I am genuinely trying to get my head around quality control and client sign off … what is the report that can be generated to provide the label to confirm the ISRC allocation (as in like a PQ Sheet). How does one get the sign off from the client? And if you can’t, what happens if the client changes the ISRC allocation prior to or in the upload process (it happens). Or is the answer that there is no practical significance if it’s “wrong”.
I guess I’m thinking about this stuff because I come from the dark world of post where the Golden Rule is “No Good Deed Goes Unpunished”.
Well, you could potentially use the basic Audio CD Report that WaveLab generates. Here’s an example from a recent session:
When you have the right metadata preset loaded, which I have set for my default new montage, you can be sure the ISRC codes get pushed to both the AXML chunk and ID3v2 if you prefer.
In my case, clients are approving a DDP via HOFA DDP Player Maker to see the ISRC codes and be aware of them etc.
I typically get the ISRC code discussion started early. My project intake form (among other things) has a place for clients to enter their own ISRC codes if they have them, or a check box if they want me to generate the ISRC codes.
If I generate the codes I send them a spreadsheet right away to verify the titles and track listing one last time incase they spot any errors. The message also explains that the ISRC codes will be on the DDP/CD master and they should use these same codes when they set up the digital distribution.
What happens beyond this is out of my control but after years of doing it this way, I’ve never been made aware of an issue.