Kontakt 6 is crashing Dorico

Hi team!

As it says in the title: Upon loading Kontakt 6.4.2 Dorico becomes unresponsive. I’m pretty sure it’s Kontakt’s problem, but maybe there’s something in the Logs (attached) that will help me find the problem, since it’s not just Dorico…

https://1drv.ms/u/s!As6Xsk81YczVrJ9ekaLmoYHuCg9RKg?e=KzzgHm

Thanks!
Benji

This certainly does appear to be a crash inside Kontakt:

VCRUNTIME140!_CxxThrowException+0x90
Kontakt+0x16a2cee

It appears that the latest Kontakt is 6.5.2, so I’d recommend updating Kontakt first, and if you have the same problem then you might need to get in touch with NI’s support.

Paul, thx for checking! It’s confirmed to be an issue with my particular installation, so no worries on your part. And it even happens with their latest version, rolling back to 6.4.2 was actually part of my troubleshooting process…

Many thx,
Benji

Folks, I have news about this issue: I talked to the rep of my Library, Best Services, using a TeamViewer Session, then to NI themselves, also with a TeamViewer Session, and now even Steinberg support (who have been very nice and responsive, btw…) has given up on my issue. Maybe there’s someone around here who can help?

This is the troubleshooting I’ve done with NI (it’s in German, but I could translate it for you… :slight_smile: ):

  • Kontakt ließ sich problemlos als VST und Cantabile laden
  • Die Standalone Version von Kontakt ließ sich problemlos laden
  • es wurden die Output-Konfiguration für die VST Version von Kontakt (zweimal) zurückgesetzt
  • wir haben den Multiprocessor Support für die VST Version von Kontakt deaktiviert
  • wir haben den Cubase ASIO Guard deaktiviert
  • Steinberg Dorico stürzt ebenfalls beim laden von Kontakt ab (erst freeze dann crash)
  • Wir haben Cubase im Safe Mode mit zurückgesetzten Einstellungen gestartet
  • Alle Windows Updates wurden installiert
  • wir haben Kontakt in die Whitelist der drei VST AudioEngines von Steinberg hinzugefügt
  • Cubase wurde als Administrator gestartet

With Steinberg Support I’ve updated my graphics driver, but to no avail…

Last resort would be reinstalling anything using Steinbergs audio engine and maybe Kontakt again. All other Plugins work like a charm.

Sincerely,
Benji

Hi Benji,
I can read the German part.
And could you please post a new Dorico diagnostics report, please. Maybe there is something new in there that could help. Thanks

Kontakt v6.5.3 landed a week or so back…
Official update status - Kontakt 6 – current: 6.5.3 | NI Community Forum (native-instruments.com)

  • FIXED Transient Master could interrupt the audio signal under certain conditions
  • FIXED Effects loaded on the Main Effects strip could interrupt the audio signal under certain conditions
  • FIXED Loading a DAW preset with missing content could lead to unexpected behaviour
  • FIXED Changing the source mode would reset the zone speed to the default value

(… No idea, but wasn’t it mentioned that in Dorico ASIO guard is always on and cannot be deactivated…? )

Hey Puma,

your link looked promising at first, but then I installed the update, and Dorico & Cubase still behaved badly…

I’d also forgotten to add this tidbit from the NI troubleshooting session:
Laut Windows Zuverlässigkeitsbericht stürzt Cubase und Dorico mit ucrtbase.dll ab.

Ulf, here’s the diagnostics from after the Kontakt update: https://1drv.ms/u/s!As6Xsk81YczVrJ9ekaLmoYHuCg9RKg?e=UEGrog

Thx for all your help, folks!

Benji

Interesting… at any rate, it crashes in Cubase regardless of the ASIOGuard setting…

Hi Benji,
sorry, no new clues, it always crashes in Kontakt the same way.
When does it actually crash, already when loading Kontakt, right?
Do you start with an already existing project or does it also crash when you start a project from scratch?

Thanks! Yeah, it’s a bit strange…
It crashes right when it tries to load Kontakt. Is there any info about plugin content contained in the audio engine? It might be that this all started when I moved the Kontakt library to a different drive, but I properly told Kontakt about it, and the standalone has no issue finding the samples. Maybe the plugin can’t find the samples? But according to NI’s changelog, that’s what they fixed in the latest updates… :neutral_face:

Edit: In Dorico as well as in Cubase it happens in a completely new empty project.

With whom were you in contact at Native Instruments? I mean, the crash dumps are so obvious, that Kontakt is bringing down the audio engine. I don’t have the code and symbols of Kontakt, so I can’t have a look what is going on there, but for Native it should be so easy to start a debugger, load the dump files and see where the trouble originates.
Then let’s do something even more basic. Start Dorico with a new project from any template you like, but make sure that Kontakt is not loaded, yet. Then go to Play Mode and on the right side is the VSTinstrument rack, okay? At the bottom there is a little plus icon, click on that and a new empty instrument slot gets created. Then, at that empty slot, use the down arrow button to open the pop up menu and select Kontakt, which in turn will try to load it into that slot. At that time Kontakt will not yet load any samples. Does it still crash though?

Ulf,
thx a bunch for following up!
The gentleman’s name at NI was Philipp P., at Steinberg it was Jan R.
The procedure you are suggesting is pretty much what I’ve been doing in Dorico, except that I just tried to change from HSSE to Kontakt in the first slot, instead of adding a new one.
Crashes the instant after clicking on Kontakt.
But I will try again today doing exactly what you proposed.

Thx,
Benji

And I also wanted to say something about this one. Cubase/Dorico don’t crash because of ucrtbase.dll but the case is like this: There is a fault in Kontakt and a so called exception gets thrown. Because there is no exception handler for it, ucrtbase.dll does catch that exception by default and of course it also does not know what to do about it and therefore it simply aborts the program. Still, the root of the exception is in Kontakt and that’s where it needs to get fixed.

Ulf,

that makes a lot of sense, but sounds like reinstalling Cubase/Dorico wouldn’t really help then, would it?
What is also curious, is that Kontakt loads fine in at least 2 other VST hosts, pretty basic ones that is, but still.
I wonder what’s different about the audio engine dealing with Kontakt as opposed to other hosts.

I tried your procedure just now, but Dorico crashes regardless, with a residual 16% CPU load actually…

Best to you,
Benji

Benji,

indeed, from my perspective it does not make sense to reinstall Dorico or Cubase. You could try though, but I don’t expect any other outcome than before.
I’m quite disappointed with Native in that they are not willing to take the case into the engineering department and have a look at the debugger. Maybe you’d just need to talk to the right guy. Sure they are all nice and friendly, but they also need to know what needs to be looked at in such case. I will try to get in touch with Native and see if I get any further.

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Hey Ulf,

Thanks so much! You guys are awesome…

Benji

Hi all, to close this issue:

After getting in touch with a senior engineer at NI, they determined it to be a bug in Kontakt, and will fix it in the next release version.
Thanks to all folks that helped and thought along with this issue!

Have a great weekend,
Benji

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