Large Template Advice

Hi all

I have a some questions re. large templates and Cubase processing/RAM resources. I’ve recently been transferring my large DP11 template to Cubase 13 with the intention of making Cubase 13 my new work DAW.

I have a maxed-out Mac Studio M2 Ultra (192GB RAM). I use many instances of Kontakt 7 (Rack), Omnisphere, Sine, Sptifire players, various other synths VIs, and VEPro7 plugins connected to VEP Server on the same mac and an additional Mac Mini. (VEP hosts most of my orchestral instruments, while synth VIs, Kontakt instrs etc. are within Cubase).

In my present Cubase 13 template (in-progress), I currently have around 2,200 tracks. I know that sounds crazy, but the majority of them are actually MIDI tracks. I always start my sessions with all VSTs disabled. Once complete, I will also have many (possibly dozens) of Group Audio and Effects tracks (in order to do large mixes and batch-printing of stems/final mixes). Right now I have around 53 VST Rack Instruments loaded, but plan to further refine it, and keep the template to no more than 55 loaded Rack VSTs total. (of these VSTs, 6-8 of them are VEP7 Plugins).

I’ve learnt that there’s a limit of 64 Rack VST instruments allowed to be hosted inside Cubase. However, does anyone know which of the following use THE MOST computer resources and/or may cause slow-downs / bottle-necking in Cubase 13. Should I be most careful / resourceful when adding MANY (sometimes hundreds) of the following ?:

  1. MIDI tracks
  2. VST Rack instruments (I’ve already noticed a slow-down the more VSTs I add)
  3. VST (Track) instruments
  4. VST Returns (default 1/2 return)
  5. Additional audio inputs from the VST returns
  6. Group audio tracks
  7. Effects tracks (with no effects yet).

Thanks,
CT

Hi and welcome to the forum,

From the list you have provided, I would definitely pick the VST Racks and VST Tracks.

Just out of my curiosity, why are not all the instruments sorting in the VEPro?

You can watch this very interesting video
which compares VEP7 and disabled tracks with a Mac
by David Kudell

VEPro vs Disabled Track Template

In my case I am on Windows 11
with Cubase 12 Pro but I am currently testing 13 in Trial version with all my tracks deactivated
As for the number of tracks I’m not shocked
I created a template with more than 4000 tracks :upside_down_face:

Thanks Martin.

I should probably rephrase my question: I’m definitely aware that VSTs are way more resource-hungry than empty MIDI/Audio tracks. I guess my question now is: VSTs and plugins aside, do the presence of hundreds/thousands of (initially empty) MIDI/Audio tracks add to Cubase being sluggish?

I host all my synths and drums, guitars etc within Cubase since their settings are always changing between each session. Otherwise I’d have to constantly save a corresponding VEP7 meta frame with each Cubase13 session which is a pain. Also, hosting all the synths etc within Cubase helps to future-proof the session if I need to open it at a later date etc. I.e. less software to open the session = less can go wrong.
Thx

Thanks Freudon.

A very informative video! I wish I could get my buffers that low :).

As it happens my template is not dissimilar to David’s conclusion: I use a kind of ‘hybrid’ template between disabled Cubase tracks and VEPro. I haven’t learnt the ‘Import Tracks’ feature yet, but that seems to definitely be a very useful option if the template you’re working on doesn’t include certain setups that you had included in another (bigger) template. Being able to import all selected tracks and their associated routing/plugins sounds very powerful.

The research continues!

For the import tracks function
Simply save your track presets
which allows you to save all the tracks which you can sort by instrument family for faster saving and access.
This allows you to save track names colors groups sends fx vca etc…
you can do this by instrument families or by instruments or by editors

Example 1 Instruments Family:

Example 2 Editors:

Example 3 Instruments:

In any case, if you create a huge template, it is strongly recommended to make these backups in order to avoid unpleasant surprises and having to reconfigure everything

I noticed by doing different tests
that which could significantly slow down Cubase
when you have a lot of tracks is to have a lot of tracks and/or folders open at the same time
The solution I found was first of all to create only the instrument family folders and no subfolders

and finally to use a lot of PLEs and Macros to show or hide the tracks depending on the tracks activated deactivated family of instruments type of articulations etc…

the aim of the game is to open the tracks you need and have the others closed

If you don’t know how to do it
here are the export and import captures
preset tracks

Export:

select the tracks you want to export:

and name your file:

To import Tracks presets:

As an FYI as you’re new to Cubase, I would highly recommend learning how to use expression maps. Not only will it significantly lower your midi track count, but I personally think it helps with the writing process. :slight_smile:

1 Like

Thanks again Freudon!

So Archiving / Importing tracks from other projects is mostly useful for bringing in routing configurations from other templates?

Can the fact of having subfolders create performance problems in itself? Or do you just mean that it’s easier to keep most folders CLOSED when there’s no nesting of folders?

Blockquote

Sorry I expressed myself badly
In fact I didn’t think about closing the files before searching with PLEs and/or Macros
this is what caused the slowdowns in the search but no performance problems with Cubase.
Now no more problems since the files are systematically closed before any search.

As for using only one folder per family, it is to avoid this cascading effect which takes up a lot of space but this is just my opinion.

But this requires creating many more PLEs and/or Macros for track visibility

Yes it is its primary use but for me it serves as a backup
since I always use my complete template

I use the two :
separate articulations and keyswitches which allows me to optimize resources so as not to unnecessarily open instruments with lots of articulations if I don’t need them
I recognize that what changes the situation a little today is the global purge options of Kontakt 7 and Opus.
But the mix of the two satisfies me for the moment