my friend & Logic X

One day cubase will be in the appstore. No need for dongle and stable, low latency software. But the program have to be rewritten. Cubase once was the “logic” daw. It has lost that approach somewhat with all features. But I am optimistic. The new notation team. At the right time the company needs great PR. Not the german dude who speaks cheezy english.

if cubase was $199 we’d get an update every 4 years that didn’t fix the underlying problems of the last version :slight_smile:

I’d rather pay double and have a program with some input and future vision.


Also remember EVERY app bought from the app store Apple takes 30% off the top, that doesn’t matter if it’s Apples apps but for 3rd parties it makes a huge difference in profitability, the playing field definitely slopes in Apples direction.

MC

You must be kidding. Studio One, Reaper, Pro Tools, Digital Performer, Sibelius and Finale are not for sale there. As Norbury just said, Apple takes 30%. It would be the single best way for Steinberg to make less money.

For (mac) customers:

  1. No dongle
  2. Install on multiple machines (that are tied to your Apple id)
  3. One button click to install

For Steinberg (the benefits)

  1. Apple handles copy protection so no R&D and customer support resources needed for dongle software
  2. Apple distributes the software (no bandwidth $$$ charges)


    Fact is: Apple customers are getting used to this distribution model and onerous install/dongle schemes such as what Steinberg uses are going to push new customers away. It’s already happening…

Sure Apple takes 30%… but most developers believe that’s a fair price for someone to handle your distribution, customer service (in regards to distribution), credit card processing, bandwidth responsibilities etc.

Huh? Logic does not have copy protection.

This is not a fact, it’s your observation. Not a single professional DAW or notation program aside from Logic is available in the apple app store.

Steinberg is not a new developer. A young guy just starting out might find 30% commission reasonable, but a company like SB, owned by Yamaha, already has established distribution channels. They offer refunds to unhappy customers, which the Apple app store does not, and they communicate with the users, which Apple does not.

Big -1 for the idea of SB products being sold in the app store.

I love the Dongle - easy and fast to handle!
I often HATE Challenge Response.

Yup. (Not that Apple really cares that much about it for their own software… But it’s there for developers to take advantage)

Developers can add an identity check if they want, though. The way that identity check works is, the app itself (not the Mac App Store App) sees if it’s got authorization to run. If it doesn’t, it asks for your Apple ID and password and then verifies that information with Apple. Once it gets the OK from Apple’s servers, it saves that authorization and continues running.

http://www.macworld.com/article/1157018/appstore_licensing.html

This is not a fact, it’s your observation. Not a single professional DAW or notation program aside from Logic is available in the apple app store.

Yet. Small indie companies (ie. Pixelmator) are making millions supplanting the old stogies, and it’s only a matter of time before the old guys need to adapt or die. And among professionals even, the fallout from the latest iLok debacle proves that customers are no longer happy with the status quo.

Steinberg is not a new developer. A young guy just starting out might find 30% commission reasonable, but a company like SB, owned by Yamaha, already has established distribution channels. They offer refunds to unhappy customers, which the Apple app store does not, and they communicate with the users, which Apple does not.

A “large” company like Steinberg has lots of overhead costs associated with organizing distribution models. There’s also a lot of investment in maintaining copy protection. Would you rather have them spend their time figuring out dongle issues and managing server status/bandwidth for each release, or would you rather they focus more resources on improving the actual software we love to use?

Yes, you can get refunds on Apple App store software.

Having an app on the Apple App store does note mean you lose the right to communicate with your customers, either.

Despite being under the Apple banner, Logic does not have a reputation for being the best, most reliable DAW. However, it IS the most affordable, easiest to buy and install DAW on the platform. Although I don’t suggest Steinberg try and play a price war with Logic (no need: Cubase has a solid rep), not having a “BUY” button for Cubase on the App store means lots of lost sales for Steinberg… and continued frustration for those of us shackled to the little plastic dongle…

the whole low price App purchase mentality is killing developers, Apple are one of the richest companies on the planet, they can give logic away for nothing, so tying to compete is just suicide for mot companies.


Steinberg have a dongle to stop people stealing their software, it’s working.

I don’t like dongles, but if it means the company who makes the software I use can stay in business then it’s a price I’ll pay.

Steinberg are small fry when it comes to how much money they make, they are not a rich company, hence the Yamaha buyout.

the whole Apple method of App store only purchases is a really really dangerous business model for every one but Apple.

they’ve just been fined millions for the whole ebook price fixing racket, they’ve eluded to pay tax in the UK, not a great example of a company I would want to be involved with.

MC

The “race to the bottom” is mainly among iOS dime-store game developers. However, that was an argument for two or three years ago. With “in-app” purchasing, many have turned the freemium model into a more profitable venture than traditional sales ever were. (I’m a developer myself, so I look at the stats, not the media headlines)

Apple are one of the richest companies on the planet, they can give logic away for nothing

People are going to compare pricing whether the app is on the App store or not. So you think a $500 app with a complicated dongle/registration scheme is the best way to keep mac users from purchasing/defecting to Logic? Yeah… I don’t think that’s a great long-term strategy for survival…

I don’t like dongles, but if it means the company who makes the software I use can stay in business then it’s a price I’ll pay.

Fact of the matter is, whether we see continued mac support for Cubase in the long run depends wholly on mac user sales. You can bet Steinberg bean-counters are watching the bottom line. And if sales drop, so will the quality of mac support (if not mac version altogether). Whether you like it or not, the convenience of the Mac App store means any software on sale there has an instant advantage over dongle-ware like Cubase.

so you’re saying the average Apple user is too stupid to purchase programs from anywhere but the Apple store?



MC

Cubase is a great product, it doesn’t need the App store, neither does 99% of professional software bought by professionals.


MC

What % of Cubase users are on Mac ? Any guesses ?

whats complicated about the dongle/registration? I can understand not wanting a dongle on a laptop if you’r working live but in a studio on a desktop its not a big deal. Pro tools users don’t seem to mind, and it hasn’t stopped pro tools from becoming ubiquitous.


God forbid Apple take control of all OSX programs via the app store, it would not be a good thing for anyone but Apple who already have a Monopoly.

MC

If the dongle/registration scheme is complicated for mac users, that means that they will never get the idea how to use Cubase in general, so why bother about iOS at all?!? :wink:

“a great long-term strategy for survival” is to make a piece of shit, update it once in 4 years, get it cracked the very next day after release and have no profit from it at all. But on the other hand get billions of satisfied users, who suffer from " the little plastic dongle…" no more. :smiley:

+1 fully agree :exclamation: :wink:

+1 !!

+1 !

Any guesses to how many Cubase mac users already bought Logic and are directly comparing to Cubase on a feature-pre-feature basis? If you don’t believe mac users are getting sick of dongles and restrictive software licenses… think again…

If the dongle/registration scheme is complicated for mac users, that means that they will never get the idea how to use Cubase in general, so why bother about iOS at all?!?

Hey, I consider myself pretty computer savvy (Apple dev, and have been using Cubase for over a decade, too) and it took me at least a half hour to go through the Cubase 6 and installation and registration process. This doesn’t include download time or the pre-install research I needed to do. All the time I was on pins and needles worrying about not getting it right and having to contact tech support to fix me up (due to the reliance on the dongle). I don’t even dare take Cubase on the road because if the dongle is lost or stolen, you need to re-purchase Cubase at full price! (don’t know what kind of hell you have to go through if it’s only damaged)

Again, I love Cubase, but in contrast, buying and installing Logic Pro X took the click of ONE BUTTON. Done! Marketing 101 says the purchase process has a huge effect on potential new customers.


Anyway, I’ve spoke my peace. Time to move on.

Any guesses to how many negative respondents to this thread actually use PC?

:unamused:

So…apart from copy protection, there’s nothing else Logic X does better than C7?

I think the dongle is a small price to pay for VST expression, the chord track, a company committed to the development of its product, etc. I also sincerely hope that Cubase never appears in the App Store - no more upgrade prices for a start.

Steinberg already has Cubasis and Cubase IC Pro in the App Store. Technically, Cubase is already there right now :stuck_out_tongue:.