Need a new DAW - is Cubase what I want?

Cubase
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PSS

Another thing that sets Cubase apart in a significant way…

It fully supports NoteExpression aspects of the VST3 protocol. Few if any other DAW goes here at this time. HALion is one of the few sound engines fully supporting it yet as well (not every instrument program for HALion takes advantage of NE, but the engine itself supports instruments designed to accept NE).

What this means is, you can attach expression data to specific notes rather than just having it floating on a controller lane. With an instrument that supports NoteExpression, you could have different notes on the same channel bending and expressing independently of one another. I.E. Pitch bends of each note in a chord…at different curves/directions/etc.

Also, traditional CCs can be bound in NE containers (still would impact an entire channel though), so they still mean the same thing to instruments that don’t recognize true NE events, but the events, being attached to a specific note, will ‘quantize’ and/or move/cut/paste/copy with the note. With traditional CC lanes, we’re always having to manage that expression data independently of the notes; but Cubase offers features to bind it to specific notes. It’s not difficult to convert expression data back and forth between note bound NE or traditional CC lanes for editing convenience.

If you often copy/paste phrases around in a score, perhaps even among different instruments, or want to use groove engines, sync to video, or otherwise experiment with different tempos, time shifts, etc…this aspect of Cubase/Nuendo is solid gold!

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I just took a look at this thread. It had 90+ posts. Frequently on here these high post threads become more like religious arguments over different OS or DAWs than actual real world discussions.

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As Im mentioned in other posts…each DAW has its strengths…I have been using Cubase since 1989 (pro24 to start) on atari and tbh I use a hybrid approach ie realtime impro and recomposing with groups of others
I am a programmer for remote scripts of Live for a chinese oem mfg…Live is NOT what you want but I use both because the realtime collaboration in Live in unsurpassed.
Cubase has always had great midi management and even in the early days, with Logical processing editor, I could write complete light shows in midi (composing really) and I tried logic etc and none were close.

Mozart and early composers would have been blown away by the tools and could have almost spontaneously dictated their comps and trialled them!!!

For the core functionality you are describing…its the correct fit. You will need to really focus on it as an instrument and this is so fundamental…sometimes things arent obvious and even forums, while helping, do not always think the way you do.

Despite Cubase trying to sometimes do too many things, its the best compromise on the market. My only criticism is that it has no scripting like python etc so workflows could be optimised by 3rd parties (eg like in the case of Max3d where it was opened up and a great strategy)
Even Live with Maxmsp is sorely missing from Cubase BUT this is not your requirement…Im just trying to be honest about overall failings

I wholeheartedly recommend Cubase for your application; etwas schon kommt aus Hamburg!

Greetings from Sydney

PS 1 critical thing in all of this; TEMPLATES…make sure you create a workflow and not just chaos…it will free your mind to right side activity and park the left brain which is opposite for creativity

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Positional capable controllers like Roli are the key here…Thanks for the explanation and Im sure it would help but simply play stuff in well, with real skill becomes all the more satisfying and realistic. I have a HPD20 that I programmed KScript in kontakt so the positional data registers the playing position on a hang drum…wow! So much fun (I used the original hang for a while in early 2000s)

Let performance and realtime skill be the foundation of what you do rather than parametrics

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This is where you will need to adjust your workflow. You are making use of the most powerful component of FL
Cubase does not have one left click draw, right click delete. It is double click to draw and delete.
Also next note does not follow the length of last note in Cubase, if that is something you use a lot.
No stretching of notes
Nothing like strum or chopper the way FL has.

This is why trying out would be beneficial, but for piano roll mouse composing, no DAW you try will give you the experience that FL gives. It is literally made for it.

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If you are not a film composer, look at Ableton. I was bought Cubase this summer just for film scoring. I am the owner of Ableton 11 as well. Great Daw! Support of Steinberg priducts is so strange for me after Ableton. Their reply to your e-mail in month or probably don’t reply, which is not perfect. The support of Ableton is much better. They always reply me. I was checked this forum and seems that Steinberg fix annoying bugs by the years…
But Cubase is still great Daw. You can check both honestly and choose what you want and what is the best for you.

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As much as I love and use Ableton…by your description…it is not a developed program in that area.

If you are truly composing not playing…then you are wasting your time on Ableton; it is BRILLIANT in the correct application thought. Its real-time improvisational ability is second to none

It sounds like you are basically playing core structures in and then voicing etc…Cubase is great in this regard

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Sorry I totally disagree with you and dont want to advise based on support…Ableton support is great and leaves Steinberg a long way behind (although remote scripting is another matter)…but product wise; Live is a long way off the op

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I don’t think so honestly. I was created music for the film in Ableton. Yeah, it was hard but all is possible now. And Ableton 11 is really sweet and not just for the live and loops. Once again, yes, it was not easy regarding the film scoring… it was the reason that I was bought Cubase this summer… But bugs with HDPi is killed my love to Cubase. Really hope that they will fixed them.

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I get what you are saying and agree…but they are a long way apart in workflow. Mixing is ok but it doesnt even handle any surround??? I dont know how you can say that Live is better in OP application? And scoring? its non existent last time I looked. Im still on 10 because they changed python versions in 11 and Im still catching up

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I was upgraded to 11. But you are right. Not so big changes. And it seems more like Ableton 10.5… but once again I purchased Cubase. And choose it after so many people told me about Reaper :wink:

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Btw. Are you using both DAWs too? Or mostly Cubase? Just interesting

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Depends; I play on a live rig generally with others/jam etc and exclusively use Live to rough out compositions…then I migrate them to Cubase for mixing, Spectral layers etc.
I use soundstaging which requires surround for both surround and downmix stereo…
So they each have an equal place

So much to learn…its best to concentrate on 1 as they are all good and then only move to another for extension not replacement

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Hi Art, is Cubase worth the effort? I think so. But it is effort, for sure. Bear with me while I ramble on about my recent move from FLStudio to Cubase 11 Pro.

Found myself in a similar situation. I’ve used FLStudio for years and got annoyed by the little things that did not quite work as they should. A friend of mine has used Cubase for years and he suggested I make the switch if I wanted to grow in my abilities. So I got the Cubase Elements trial and was disappointed. Many features that FLS has were absent, so it was certainly not a growth option. Checking Steinberg’s website, I noted that Pro would have the capabilities I was looking for. But I let it go for a while. If I was going to make the leap, it had to be to Cubase Pro. So much was certain. This summer Steinberg had a very good deal for Pro, so I took it … And got overwhelmed.

There is a myriad of details that never present themselves in FLS. A studio setup, audio connections setup, devices setup, you name it. They all have preferences; they all need tweaking. And when everything is in order, they all present options that you’ll never find in FLStudio.

This is where I found out that the Steinberg documentation is next to useless for novice users like me. Oh, you can find everything, but the manual is written for (and by) those that know the program, understand the workflow, are familiar with (Steinberg’s) terminology and are reasonably versed in music theory. In short: it is a typical German manual. (Although the English is flawless). … But there is YouTube! I’ve watched days worth of YouTube and slowly I’m beginning to put the pieces together.

If you have third-party VST plugins, they will work in Cubase … if they are 64 bit. Otherwise, you’ll need something like Jbridge (it works!) to get them to work. None of the Image-line VST’s will work. Be prepared for that. So, moving a project from FLStudio to Cubase requires “re-engineering”. And FLStudio has many more VST-plugins than Cubase has.

Effects like delays, reverbs, eq’s etc. will work differently. They will sound different. But you’ll understand these quickly enough. And you’ll find that only Cubase Pro will match FLStudio in options.

My workflow has not changed very much from FLS to Cubase. Editing midi is about the same. But then Cubase has “lanes”, track versions, and what not. Undoubtedly useful, but not (yet?) to me. Cubase has many features that cater to the needs of making session recordings. Something I do not do.

It has been 8 weeks that I’ve been working with Cubase. I’m still learning and watching Youtube tutorials quite often, although I’ve started to make a little music again without the program interfering with that to the breaking point, where creativity is being stifled by technicalities.

Would I go back to FLStudio? I don’t think so. Would I stop using FLS altogether? Most certainly not. Has the switch been worth it? Hard to say at this point, but I think so. Cubase sounds different, is more precise (so it feels) and has the quality of a complicated instrument that you need to learn to understand. It is indeed more “musical” than FLStudio, and you can hear that in your productions.

Does this help?

–Ron–

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So how DO you enter notes in Cubase? And when you say “stretch” note, what do you mean? Say I enter a quarter-note and I decide it sounds better as a dotted quarter-note - can I take my mouse and stretch it out to 50% longer? Do the notes that I enter with my mouse snap to some sort of grid or width so I can get uniform note sizes?

FL Studio is unacceptable because it knows nothing about music.

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My expectation would be to move existing work as MIDI files and then assign whatever the closest instrument is in Cubase. Does the Cubase “Pro” product come with a decent stock grand piano and any decent woodwinds? Does it come with at least one decent general-purpose synthesizer (e.g., Sytrus on FL Studio)?

I’m musically trained and FL Studio most definitely is not for musically trained users. Are there are other DAWs good for composing that I should be considering for their musical heritage?

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Yes, you can stretch the note value, or even entire groups of notes at the same time. Grab and stretch. If the grid or cursor snap is toggled on, it snaps to the closest grid or cursor position where you let go of the mouse, if you want free control of where the note ends, you toggle snap off.

You can also quantize the beginning and ends of notes independently so they snap to the grid. You can also automate the process of creating legato effects (end of previous notes overlap the next note by your preferred amount).

You can also use MIDI logic editors to adjust note lengths as a batch process.

And more…

You can use step input mode, and drop notes in using your MIDI keyboard, or with the little emulated keyboard included in Cubase that uses keys on your qwerty keyboard.

Yes, you can control note lengths before you enter them. There are a pair of grid settings to do this, which can be bound to keyboard keys on your computer and/or MIDI events from your favorite controller.

You may also set a default velocity for notes entered, or in the case of using your MIDI controller, you could tweak settings so whatever velocity you use when striking the key is applied.

For me it’s…tap an MPC pad to set the note value I want (from 64th notes to whole notes, another pad toggles dot on/off), tap the keys I want on my MIDI keyboard, repeat…

I’ve also got cursor control events assigned on my MIDI controller, so it’s no problem moving about to any grid position I want without even touching the computer.

To accomplish this I use something Cubase offers called ‘generic remote’ maps. These let you bind MIDI events to pretty much ANY control in Cubase. I chose to use the MPC pad bank since my controller has those, but one could also set aside an octave or so of ‘keys’ at one end or the other of the keyboard if you don’t have a lot of ‘buttons or pads’ at hand.

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OK, so it doesn’t sound that different from FL Studio. Why did Ozinga say that going to the Cubase Piano roll needs a big adjustment?

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There will be differences and workflow adjustments, but fear not, the MIDI editors in Cubase are really powerful. Perhaps the best on the market.

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On another thread (—it won’t let me post links - ) @Alexander_D says there is a problem running Cubase on 4K displays. Others seem to disagree. Since I run on a Windows 10 4K system with an Nvidia Quadro RTX 4000 graphics card this would be a deal breaker for me. Is there a known problem?