Numbering of Instruments with different transpositions

Is there any way to get Dorico to be more generous with what it considers “the same instrument” for grouping purposes?

Contrary to standard practice, it considers, say, Horn in F and Horn in Bb to be different instruments so you get 2 pairs of Horn 1/2 instead of Horn 1/2/3/4

Why not just add the numbering manually in Edit Names? Pretty quick.

TylerE, please forgive my ignorance: in which kinds of ensembles do you find pairs of horns with different transpositions that are nonetheless numbered as a single group? This isn’t a practice I’m familiar with, but of course I’m not familiar with the conventions of every possible ensemble in every historical period.

I’m not the OP, but Dvorak Symphony Number Eight for one. Two horns in F and two in D, numbered 1,2,3,4. I’d like to be able to easily do what the OP wants as well. (Also, the D horns in this case are D basso, written in Bass Clef BELOW sounding pitch. It would be great if Dorico provided for that possibility, which is common in music of that era.)

While we’re on the subject of Horns, I’ve always been taught (and felt) that they are really a group of their own, about halfway between woodwinds and brass. That kind of bracketing and grouping are very easy now but it would be cool if Dorico officially had an option to treat them that way by default, if wished. Then it would be easy to show tempo making, metronome, etc., at the top of Horns and also at the top of Brass, both, without disrupting anything else.

Well, one score I looked at was the Strauss Alpine symphony. Horns 1/2 are in F, 3/4 in Bb (basso). Also the Wagner tubas (2 Tenor, 2 Bass) are numbered 1-4.

Actually, looking around at scores on IMSLP I’m having a hard time finding scores where this isn’t the case.

Brahms 1: Hn 1/2 in C, 3/4 in Eb
Brahms 2: 1/2 in D, 3/4 in E
Brahms 3: 1/2 in C, 3/4 in F
Brahms 4: 1/2 in E, 3/4 in C
Balaikarev 1: Clarinet 1/2 in A, 3 in Bb
Berlioz Harold in Italy: Horn 1/2 in G, 3/4 in D
Dvorak 7: Hn 1/2 in F, 3/4 in D
Mahler 1: Trp. 1/2 in F, 3 in Bb
Saint-Saens 3: Horn 1/2 in C, 3/4 in F, Trp. 1/2 in F, 3 in C
Wagner Walkure: Horn 1/2 in F, 3/4 in D

Hardly an exhaustive list but that’s what I found paging through a good chunk of the scores I’ve downloaded from IMSLP.

In fact, I didn’t find a single score out of the ones I looked through that had separate numberings. A few were “2 Horns in E / 2 Horns in C” or just “Horns in E/Horns in C”. But those that actually numbered the players ALWAYS grouped by the coarser instrument type.

It’s certainly possible that modern practice has changed but I generally don’t have easy access to modern copyright-era scores.

Thanks for bringing this up, I wasn’t aware of Dorico’s behaviour here… :astonished: I totally agree that instruments of the same type/name should be numbered sequentially regardsless of their tuning…!

We’ll look into adding an option for this in a future version. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

This is very common for our brass ensemble works…for example

Instrumentation: 423.11 brass ensemble

Piccolo Trumpet 1 in A
Trumpet 2 in E♭
Trumpet 3 & 4 in B♭
2 Horns in F
2 Trombones
Bass Trombone

Is there any good reason why your Piccolo Trumpet is included in the numbering of trumpets, while your Bass Trombone is not included in the numbering of trombones…? :confused:

I have been hesitant to request this feature since January. Thank you!

I wondered the same. Sometimes you just have to recognise that you’re looking for logic in the wrong place :wink:

Basstrombones normally don’t switch between different trombones (except for the contrabasstrombone for some orchestral pieces), but (professional) trumpet players have got a big case with lot’s of trumpets (and mutes) and they can play different instruments and so the indication for trumpet player 1 in this case is, that he has to take (one of) his piccolo trumpet(s). Makes sense to me …

One exception I have found upon further review is that the Piccolo (Eb, which Dorico doesn’t actually list as a Piccolo clarinet) is usually numbered seperately, although not always.

When picc is numbered separately it causes confusion in rehearsals.