Padshop, no uploading samples??

Uh, Alchemy is not a granular synth … mine is not at the least, is granular becoming a buzzword rather than an architectural description ?

There are VA’s that do not have filters, a filter at the end of the chain is not a defining feature of analogue synthesisers but merely of the “German strand” of analogue synths, e.g. Trautonium>Bode>Moog, there are even variants of that strand such as versions of Buchla and the good old Davioli that did not come with filters at all.

Furthermore, granular synthesis pre-dates sampling so saying that it MUST have user sample facility is a bit odd, the reason some sample based synths do not have user sample option is that the “samples” are not samples at all but rather processed data, Steinberg Plex for instance was based on samples but heavily processed and the skill set to make usable hand tuned Plex data out of a raw sample simply does not exist out there so Wolfgang Palm never even considered releasing the toolset required for user samples.

Even in synths with simpler processing requirements the data may be based on samples but not be a sample per se but for instance resonance data only, having this allows the synth designer to make an “resonance oscillator” that has a specific function and features different from the standard but at the same time also makes difficult to develop end user sample manipulation tools that do not require some understanding of basic acoustic theory.

In any event, going mental on a forum about a synth on the day of its release is extremely narrow minded, download it, try it for a few days, explore the nooks and crannies of its corners and then come back and complain, attacking the makers of tools you have no or limited experience with is not helpful to anyone

And stop calling other people on the forum Asses and Fanboys, these are after all the people you are going to have to ask for help at some point in the future, they are not likely to respond to your queries if they have already placed you in their “twatfilter”

Though based on the principal of sampling, Granular Synthesis is not implicitly based on “samples”.
(As in stored sampled sounds, that is.)

A sampler consist of sampling, storage and playback from storage. It uses sampling to record audio levels at some frequency, stores the result as a stream of samples and can then replicate what it “heard” by playing the stream of samples back out. The samples of a stream COULD be called grains to show the similarity in thinking.

A GS based synthesizer generates sound by playing grains. The grains COULD be the samples of the stream above, or even lengthier extracts from the stream (which is how Padshop does it). However, the grains could also be waveforms generated from other sources, for example in realtime. Such a version could be looked at as a two part engine, one that generate grains (somewhat like generated oscillators in “traditional” synthesizers), and another that fuses them and plays them like a new sound.

Though Padshop uses samples to generate its grains, it could potentially be modified with a grain generator (like morphable oscillator type waveforms) to yield seemingly indefinite sonic possibilities. I am not an expert on GS, in any way, but I can see that as a future possibility. It would be cool to be able to use your own samples, sure, but having access to a grain generator that you can manipulate in realtime, just like the GS engine itself, would yield an even cooler result, I think. :slight_smile:

Wikipedia - Granular Synthesis
Granular Synthesis by Eric Kuehnl

That is not the complete truth.

I have both Skanner and Padshop. If you get Skanner there are only 10 samples you can work with beside you are owner of Reaktor (I am). If you use Skanner free without having or buying Reaktor you are only dependent on these ten samples and you cannot change it. Padshop has hundreds of samples.

So Skanner is something like a bait for buying Reaktor or Komplete from NI.

And due Skanner is something like a granular synth it works in a rather different way than padshop and you can hardly compare these beasts and their sounds.

But I would like to load samples too. But that is simply a feature request.

I hope that Steinberg listen to us and in Padshop v1.1 allow us to import user samples.
Its useless a granular synth without this option.
It’s a pity…Padshop could have been one of the best synth ever, but without user samples…is simply another one that everyone will forget in a moth, like embrace, monologue, mystic…etc.etc.

Maybe…are they planning to release sample packs?? and sell them?

:frowning: :frowning: :frowning: :frowning:

Sorry, but with honest respect.
When you say it is useless you never had your hands on it. It is extremely flexible and you have an endless palette of sounds and the weirdest parameters to play with. And as someone stated before the theory on granular synthesis does not depend on samples. It depends on an input stream and its restructuring from small snippets. A typical place for granular synthesis is time and pitch shifting. And the modulation and (re)structuring of grains can also be used on live input.

As I said: It would be nice to have the possibility to load samples. But this is not what granular synthesis is about. As for loading samples: I would like more to have a live input for padshop to freak out with my guitar and voice…

Careful with how you word that because Padshop does not do live processing like a granular insert effect. You know there are outboard grainshifters available to toy with, I think the KAOSS Pad line has one.

You’re right about Padshop having a vast array, perhaps infinite palette of sounds. But you can say the same thing about Skanner with only 10 samples, or any Granular synth engine with just a single sample. Its the ability to morph your own samples thats really intriguing though. Take your voice and upload it into Padshop, or your own guitar riff and granularize it into a pad that sits behind the original riff in the mix. Stuff like that is the real joy of creation; true customization. Padshop is capable sure… but without user customization, is ultimately a passing toy as Andros1983 pointed out.

People on other forums are saying the same thing. One person said something that really resonated with me. They made the point that Steiny/Yammy should’ve charged twice as much and given us the ability to upload samples like every other Granular synth. Maybe they’re going to offer sample packs but sorry, this synth just doesn’t capture my interest without true programmability. Which is just a shame because it is a really decent granular engine. So lets say they charge $30 dollars per set like most of the current ones available. A user would have to purchase two sets to make it worth Steinberg’s while to lock out the ability for user samples. Do you really see yourself purchasing two more sets for Padshop’s already extensive library of over 500 samples (~506)? Or even a single $50 dollar set? I think it would have been financially smarter for them to have simply included the ability to load your own samples while doubling the price.

Lets keep our fingers crossed for a fix. In all honesty I don’t see it happening however because they would’ve just released it full force from the damn get go. My prediction is they’re going to milk it with the VST Sound Set route.

I know that. I only wanted to say, that I would like something like this. But thinking about it I conclude, that this would have vast influence on latency of this VST(i). Because the synth has to recalculate the grain continuously. Probably you can get used to it like with reverse delay or in combination with delay. Guitar Rig has such a thing. And Uhbik has a nice granular effect “Uhbik-G”.
With samples you could always use a look ahead algorythm. So samples would be OK. But I knew that padshop has not the possibility to load samples. So I had zero concerns.
For now I have enough to try with padshop. I just scratched the surface and have lot of fun.

It would be nice to have an official answer on this, do you plan to implement a sample loading function?

I think that is a VERY important feature of a granular synth, I was really looking forward to doing some manipulation and sound design on my own tracks, but I can’t do that. It is a basic feature found on virtually any granular synth out there. It’s like selling a sampler without a sampling function, making it a record player with speed controls.

monolake granulator is better than this…and it is free…

i can’t use my percussion sound in padshop…WTF=?= :mrgreen:

Free…

Only for people that use Ambleton Live 8.2.2 AND a $250 upgrade.

“Free” indeed…

So, based upon the fact that Padshop is multi-DAW capable and cheaper:
Padshop is better than Monolake Granulator!!!

yes freee for me who have live…
padshop is not free for who have CUMbase 6…this is the same yhing :slight_smile:

however,creativy is first??? where…for now i must use your sound…think to that

thank you

So padshop is as free to Cubase 6.5 users, as monolake is to Ableton Live 8.something something users?

Not exactly. You need to have a specific add-on to Ableton to use it. $250 new, $99 upgrade. If you’ve got it, sure. If you don’t…

It was actually a sarcastic question (obviously not towards you). :wink:

:laughing:

I read in your signature that you own Komplete 8. It’d be worthwhile to work yourself a bit more into the possibilities KONTAKT has to offer.

E.g. load a vocal sample, click the wrench (edit mode) and choose the ‘tone machine’ mode.
This particular mode splits a given sample into microsamples. Isn’t that what granular synthesis is about?

Activate ‘Legato’, change the speed & formant parameters, assign an oscillator to the tune button, adjust its rate as you wish & play with the resulting sounds on your keyboard…

You got the beast onboard (KONTAKT + the more complex ABSYNTH that does granular synthesis as well), why not let it out?

Excellent advice, Joan. Unfortunately what I have are the light, free, poor-man ‘player’ versions of Kontakt, Reaktor, etc. If I enable it, I can run the full versions of the players for 30 minutes before they lock. I could get ghetto with it and do 30 minute sound design sessions and export the results at the end, but I’d rather take my time and experiment freely while working.

Thanks for the advice anyway.

Try Padshop Pro…

Yeah I got as soon as it came out of course! It’s the best thing ever. I would’ve been willing to pay a lot more than the asking price too.