Paid upgrades is a scam

Upgrade Nuendo from v12 to v13, price: 200,-
Is the selling price of v13 Nuendo in the shop also 200,- more than v12?
Nope.
So why are we long time users paying hefty prices for upgrades, while the sale price stays the same?
I am a user from v1 already so by now i paid at least twice the sale price.
I don’t think this is the way to treat loyal customers. It’s not fair.
Upgrades need to be free !!!

“end rant”

Geert.

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That would mean that you would see the same range of functions as in v1 in v13, wouldn’t it? Or how else would the development work be remunerated if not by adequate upgrade fees?

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because the ever expanding product keeps attracting new customers, who pay the same price as i did when i bought v1

Chances are you’ve made at least as much money with Nuendo since v1 was released 25 years ago. … hopefully. :slight_smile:

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well, sure. but that is not the issue. i think 200 every year or so is just too much. just my opinion.
Because it’s not just nuendo, also wavelab, dorico and Spectralayers

Hard to know even where to begin with this. The sense of entitlement is astonishing.

You pay for the added features each version provides. That’s fair.

When you do that you get to use those features for however long you choose to stay on that version. Talking about v1 that’s over two decades old is just silly. Like Dietz said you should have made at least that amount of money over two decades of use, and if it was a problem to spend that money then nobody forced you. And if you needed to get those added features in new versions then they had value. And you pay for value. Paying for added value is fair in a capitalist system.

Nuendo isn’t really a just toy for hobbyists, it’s a professional tool. Every single software that I’m aware of that has an initial license with perpetual free upgrades is either a very simple, limited software, or it is sold by a company that makes its revenue mainly from selling other things, like hardware.

If you want to argue “fairness” then I’m all for it but that to me just leads to promoting Socialism (which I do) over Capitalism (which I loathe). But that’s not really what you’re saying.

If you do some basic math based on reasonable assumptions you’ll see that doesn’t really make sense.

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Very unpopular opinion:
In a commercial environment, you should make that in half a day. (even less)
In a non-commercial environment, that’s the amount of money you spend in the pub over a weekend
So get real.

Fredo

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Indeed. And then there is that other DAW, what’s it called again? Oh yes, Pro Tools Ultimate. What does that cost per year again? 200 is a steal, really.

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@Fredo , while I agree with you and think OP must be out of his mind, I think it is valid to remember that not everywhere is Europe or the US, and in many many countries 200 euros is a LOT of money. And these places have post production needs too.

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Do you need all of these programs to accomplish what you need to do? Then buy them all. If you don’t need them all, then don’t buy them all. If you do buy them all, you will already know that these are very different applications for fundamentally different types of work. They are also made by totally separate teams, even different offices in different countries. How do you suggest they get paid for developing the tools that we depend on every day to do our job?

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Also I would argue that if you are getting Nuendo, never mind all those other tools, rather than just Cubase or the like you fall into one of two camps:

  1. You use these for a living and you actually need the advanced features Nuendo has over what Cubase can do. In that case, suck it up and pay the extra. $200/year for a piece of software is not a lot in the realm of business expenses.

  2. You just like having all the fun shiny toys. This is me, I don’t do this professionally, I just like having the best toy to play with. In that case, be fine with what it costs, or don’t buy it, but don’t complain because you DON’T need to spend the money, if you don’t want to.

If you are someone who’s just tinkering or who has more basic needs, there’s plenty of cheaper options out there even just from Steinberg, never mind others. One of my coworkers likes to tinker but unlike me he doesn’t want to blow tons of money to have the shiniest toy so he has Cubase Elements and he’s very happy.

Nuendo doesn’t seem unreasonable to me because it really is the “You only need this if you are doing high end post/video game stuff,” product. It isn’t like there aren’t plenty of cheaper options, and they don’t remove things that you have to have more most use cases.

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I usually wait for the 50% upgrade offer which comes out a few moths after the update release. I often dont need all the high end features, but there’s usually a few quality of life enhancements which make the purchase worthwhile.

If updates bother you use Logic Pro in a Mac . No updates fees ever. Of course you’ll come back to Nuendo for Post-work pretty quickly… !! :wink:

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Hmmmm Recession is setting in- anyway (thanks to Middle East)
Nonetheless our biggest problem is not upgrade but getting assistants who know how to use Nuendo so we started posting in-depth tutorials.
We don’t have the luxury to tell our assistants -Adapt or perish
So somewhere down all this could be related.

For example 1€ is ₹ 94
Small Indi Studio in India Average saving minus studio and home expenses salary rent bills etc. is ₹8,000 to 12,000/month.(87 €)
Most saving go into reserve funds in case a graphic card blowsup (poopies like this happens).
Nuendo upgrade ₹18,364.00
So sometimes upgrades can become tight.

Now Apple Logic (midi and scoring) onetime cost is 19,000 and Davinci Resolve audio for post is ₹28,980
This shows their abundance.

On the other hand Microsoft, Autodesk and Adobe have special and highly affordable pricing country wise.

So a solution could lie somewhere in the middle.
Anyway we will know it in a months time…

I just started using V13, of Nuendo only recently but purchased (upgraded) during one of the recent specials, however you can skip a version if you want and there are always specials the following year that make it worthwhile.

it’s actually, the Near East in terms of geography, unless you are talking about some other war

To the original poster.
It is dead simple. If you don’t want to pay €200,- euros for an upgrade, don’t upgrade. It is your choice, nobody forces you to do anything.
If you need new features than you have to pay for them.

Actually the Arabs call it middle east as Baghdad - Damascus caliphate sat in the center of Emirate of Granada to Delhi Saltanat. Even now most Arab and Indian news channels use Middle East rather than Near East.

I still have Nuendo ver4 from Pinnacle Systems and for its day it was revolutionary. There was nothing like it in the market.

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This is the second time I’ve seen the word ‘scam’ tossed around on this forum in the last few months.
I’m a commercial user of Steinberg products so I have a vested interest in seeing the company remain healthy and profitable. If that means paying $200 a year (and getting product improvements along the way), I’m OK with that.
Comparing to Logic is rather pointless. Apple could quite happily run Logic as a loss-leader (they could give it away if they felt like it) to entice musicians and engineers on to the Apple ecosystem. Steinberg does not have that luxury.
That you’re not happy with the upgrade fee doesn’t make it a ‘scam’. It just means you don’t like it. There’s a difference.

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Language always faces “challenges” when words are redefined without care. It is a pet-peeve of mine so thanks for pointing it out.

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I am using Nuendo 13, and the entire interface is so much more well defined, when compared with previous versions, and as well, a complete set of options, in terms of routing and signal management is also available.

I will never go back to a prior version, as of this time, unless there is a shift in ticks, in relation to automation nodes that would be time consuming to edit in the project page, since version 12 has the Project Browser, wheras 13 does not.

Cheers, all.

I await the next update!