Performance vs Cubase 12

Hi all. I’ve been doing some recording in Cubase 12 recently, including low latency monitoring of drum playing. One thing that struck me is that Cubase 12 can run many, many more plugins before I start to encounter pops/clicks. I have a feeling that is at least partly because of ASIO guard adding a few extra samples of buffer. But just as a comparison, I can run a project with multiple instances of UAD Sound City and Capital Chambers on cubase, among many other plugins, and my performance meter is still much lower than the meter on live when I run far fewer plugins. I cannot even run many of the plugin alliance brainworx plugins on Live because pops/clicks occur, especially when I am making changes on the plugin settings using their GUI. No such issue in Cubase. Given Live probably derives from Cubase in part, I was wondering if there is an explanation for that difference? Has there been consideration to adding ASIO guard to live as an option? I would give up a bit more latency for better stability. I don’t have many options in Live at this point because I don’t want to have to move from 128 samples to 256 as that becomes unplayable. Thanks for any thoughts on this issue. I have quality components including an RME Dante card and Macbook M3 Max, so it’s not a function of old tech.

…yet…

That’s a contradiction.

ASIO Guard processes playback (!) ahead, but that will not help with plugins you use with realtime operation (Layers, Stacks, tracks that have Monitoring enabled). What plugins do you use that cause so much load, and where (Layers, Stacks, Tracks…)? Is there any difference with the same amount of plugins in the same places, and the same buffer (latency) setting on the same hardware system (with, or without ASIO Guard)?

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Sorry for the delayed response here, Music. The playback issue makes sense as I’ve been recording 12 drum tracks on live and then playing them back. Cubase obviously handles that issue better because of the ASIO guard feature buffering the playback. It’s easier for me to hear pops/clicks on Live when I’m listening to playback as opposed to playing the drums. I wouldn’t expect Live to include ASIO guard if it only applies to playback (although that could be helpful for people that want to use tracks and apply effects rather than print the effects to recordings).

The plugins that cause load are the heavier UAD plugins like Sound City and Capital chambers, as I previously mentioned. For whatever reason, most of the plugin alliance (brainworx) plugins appear to pop and click at 128 samples, as do the SSL native plugins. Waves has been pretty good so far, but the current live project I’ve been using now no longer shows any input through the Waves CLA epic plugins. Other reverb effects work fine. I’m going to try to update the Live to the current build and will report back. I’ve also had instances where stacks just stop working and if I add a new stack with the same inputs, it works again. Overall, the program still seems glitchy compared to Cubase but I that is understandable at this point given Cubase has been around for decades.

I will try to run a similar project on Cubase w/o ASIO guard and will report back. Anecdotally, Cubase seems to be able to run more plugins but let me try something more 1:1 and get back to you.

I was having a similar issue with an RME Digiface USB, 128 samples on Cubase was flawless when processing in realtime 4 vocals, 2 guitars, bass, and 8 channels of drums, plus a few backing tracks and a couple VSTis here and there, but when trying to replicate the setup on VLive I would get clicks and pops.
It seems some BX plugins act up, but I’ve found that going to 256, quit VLive, open again, go back to 128, quit and open again will usually get rid of the problem at least for a while, enough to keep on working without distractions.
Not ideal but so far so good. Also, it seems to me that 1.4.13 is substantially more stable.

Are you sure? What if you disable ASIO Guard (and multi-processing, if enabled)?

Update on this. First, I’ve learned the UAD native plugins are not zero latency, so that is probably one of the issues I am experiencing trying to run a low buffer in Live. I’m going to make 2 equivalent projects with zero latency plugins, one in Cubase 13 and one in the current build of Live and I will let you know if one handles latency better than the other (I will disable ASIO guard at plugin level).