Play mode: Dynamics conflicting with CC

Between the dynamics lane and the CC lane I see some conflicting info that is making the volume levels seemingly fight each other - leading to jittery volume changes. How do I fix this?

I am using an expression map with volume dynamic set to CC1 and a secondary volume set to CC11 - in case that is relevant. Also, I checked that there is not another staff assigned to that endpoint instrument that has conflicting dynamics or CC info.

What library are you using?

Spitfire Symphonic series. In case it’s relevant I have them assigned to “CC mapped velocities” within the Spitfire instrument.

Can you attach a minimal example that reproduces the problem? You could try deleting all of the other players and flows, and attach a snippet of just a few bars for one of the instruments, so we can take a look. It’s unfortunately very difficult to diagnose these kinds of problems from a screenshot.

Actually my first question would be if it’s a native Dorico file or MusicXML import? Just that with my newly acquired BBC Core library, there are some odd things happening to the dynamics with music XML imports whereas with a native project it works more or less as expected using CC1 primary CC11 secondary like yourself. SS Series could work differently of course.

Unfortunately I’m on holiday this week so I can’t look at this in detail but in the unlikely event Daniel and co can’t get to the bottom of it, I’ll check it out when I’m back.

I’ve made a couple of screen recordings to more clearly show the problem. I tried .mov and .m4v files, but they won’t attach due to “invalid file extension.” How do I attach these?

If they’re smaller than 2MB you can zip them up and attach them, but probably they’ll be much larger than 2MB, and you’ll need to upload them to a cloud storage site like Dropbox, Google Drive, or similar. However, a minimal Dorico project would still be much more likely to lead to a successful resolution of the problem than a video, if that’s possible to provide.

Here is the minimal Dorico File:
DynvCC (1.17 MB)
You can see the conflicting CC info in the automation lane in Play mode (m.54). My hunch is that CC1 and CC11 are not tracking together for some reason and therefore conflicting.

I haven’t added any CC curves. I have an expression map with “Volume dynamic” set to CC1 as well as “Use Secondary Dynamic” set to CC11. All three staves (Trombone 1-3) are set to the same endpoint sound.

Yes I did import it (as a MIDI file not XML), but I checked the original file and there was no controller info any kind saved with the original MIDI file. What I’m experiencing is not on all tracks. It’s just in certain spots, but I can’t find a reason why.

… I thought this was considered a bad idea … :question:

How exactly did you set the secondary controller? Is it set to match CC1 for all patches on all instruments or is there a qualifying range in some instances (such as 30 - 100 or whatever). In theory this should not be relevant for jitter but one issue I had with a different library was the main volume. Was reset to max after any patch change if you used velocity. If you’re using an existing EM rather than your own, some instruments or patches may set the primary to vel instead of CC. Again, as you seem to be on CC1 and 11, this doesn’t appear on the surface to be relevant and I don’t yet have evidence that there is a problem if you do — most likely for shorter patches.

It may be that you’ll see something in the areas mentioned but unfortunately I’m flying blind a bit here without Dorico access just now and I’ll keep quiet in the meantime unless I have something fairly concrete.


Fratveno’s comment actually led me to the solution. Assigning all three staves to the same endpoint instrument in itself is not a problem…but assigning them the same MIDI Channel is.

The endpoint instrument (Spitfire Symphonic Brass) was set to receive in OMNI so I figured whateve midi channel it was sending on was irrelevant. Not so. Trombone 2 is now channel 2, and 3 is 3. And, presto, problem gone!

Thanks everyone!