Render in Place - no exact timing?


  1. Empty project, I create a Retrolouge track.
  2. Record some chords as MIDI.
  3. Render in Place this MIDI and get an audio version.
  4. Phase invert the audio file.

Result: when playing both the MIDI and the phase inverted audio track I hear phasing instead of total cancellation.

When I duplicate the audio and null test the two audio files they completely cancel each other out, the result is silence.

Is running both MIDI and phase inverted audio and no cancellation seems not to be normal…,

Any idea?

I don’t think it’s timing…you can null any sample based synth or drum machine fine which suggests render timing is fine in general.

I guess it’s something about the analogue modeled synths specifically (prologue and the couple of korgs I tested were the same)…but confusingly you can make multiple renders that will all null with each other which seems to rule out purposely introduced randomness.

Yes, a major problem comes from the free running oscillator of any synth.

Scenario 1:

  1. Set the Retrologue to fixed oscillator phase in the instrument track
  2. duplicated this instrument track
  3. polarity inverted the duplicated track. The result:
    it nulled instantly as it should be!

Scenario 2:

  1. I RIP this fix phased osc MIDI pattern.
  2. The audio is then phase inverted.
  3. Now the original instrument track and the polarity inverted RIP audio track runs parallel, the result:
    I get sounds occasionally, so RIP does not seem to be sample accurate!

But why do you want to get silence ? and phase cancellation what is the musical utilities I dont get it??? Unless youre a tech doing some experience

I do not have time to explain this, please read more about polarity inversion and phase cancellation and what’s their real use when testing audio.

Anyone else?

Oh, so you ARE a techie testing audio.
For what it’s worth, MIDI and analog synths have always phased for me.
Not that it actually makes any difference in the music.