Still no sidechaining...since years :D

Cubase
1

Hi folks.

I made some months vacancies with Cubase. Perhaps because it makes so much fun.

Now I bought 15 pro. It was THE ultimate offer. And I don’t know, what to do with it. I’m reading the whole day, watching videos. What I want to do…cool techno gating… doesn’t function. Pretty strange. And the topic is as old as I’m using Cubase. Sidechaining … gate.

I remember, that there might be - by whatever reason - a problem, which kind of track one is using. So I rendered in place my MIDI-Tracks. I work with MIDI. In my opinion a natural thing. No?

What happens? If not a bug - that I found in Google KI - it reders to an audio track. The original MIDI-Track…is dead then. Klicking on the keys…pling pling. Functions. The MIDI-notes…not triggering. Dead. Rendering kills a track. Interesting.

This way you can quickly shoot your work of weeks quickly onto the moon. Dangerous. And because I know, that Cubase is dangerous, I first experiment on special tracks.

Gating with a pattern. Not possible.

I created a MIDI-Pattern. Activated the Gate insert of the track i want to hop around. I found three locations for that. Strange & confusing, because each one shows a different screen. To simply eliminate an insert in the mixer…is not possible. One time there, forever there. Can be activated, deactivated, exchanged. But empty the insert-slot - nope.

I’m sure it has reasons, why I can’t name the source for the gate in the gate itself. Would be easy. Too easy? So … what did a video say…go here, there, klick on activate, then on this symbol right beside… “gear” symbol…choose a source. Problem: the MIDI track, that should be the source, is not available. Because MIDI cannot trigger something? Why not?

I rendered the MIDI-Track. ROFL…the original is destroyed by that. Okay…this is not accepted as a source either.

End of the story.

How complicated can it be? On my workstation…go on the track, you want to manipulate…effect…klick on “sidechain”…click on source…chose any of the tracks, you have.

2

If you’re using a VST that needs audio for gating then you’d need an audio source.

Perhaps you just need a different effect that uses MIDI as a gate source?

3

Yes, I remember such a thing. Unfortunately not one single instruction says “work with Cubase is only possible with audio tracks”.

Okay. My workstation uses audio too for sidechaining. Some experiments show that. Because audio is kind of imprecise, you have to fiddle around. For example: different kick drums to trigger, different effect. But it is a MIDI-instrument. This audio-thing happens behind the scene. I don’t have to worry about anything.

Second problem: workflow. My work is based on MIDI. Composing, editing, develop/experiment ideas…MIDI is the non-plus-ultra for this! To work with audio means to render. Each time! Murderous workflow. And… it destroys all my MIDI-work. So, copy the MIDI-tracks - each time -, destroy the copies with rendering… pretty strange workflow, isn’t it?!

“Different effect” means “different plugin”. Additional costs. By the way, “techno” does not exist in Cubase. Means: costst, costs, costs.

4

ok - someone should let Kraftwerk know…

5

“Sidechaining” happens with actual audio signals interacting with one another. MIDI is a bunch of computer data telling a synth what to play, when to play and for how long.

If you want ‘sidechaining’ happening before you record the tracks, you need to run your synths/drums through some actual compressors/limiters with external key inputs and do it that way. Otherwise, no sidechaining is happening until you have audio tracks and throw a compressor plugin on something that allows you to insert an external track as the key input.

6

No. Rendering doesn’t kill a track.

7

I tried all possible combinations. That’s my usual workflow with Cubase. Because neither a description nor video instructions function.

Mathematically 4 possibilities:

  1. Track MIDI (instrument, VST) - gate trigger MIDI (would be perfect for me)

  2. Track rendered Audio - gate trigger MIDI

  3. Track MIDI - gate trigger audio

  4. Track audio - gate trigger audio

Tell me, which case is possible at all. So that I know, where to research the next weeks, until I find the one hint.

8

You’re aware, that this isn’t of any help? Things are exactly as I described them above. No matter, if you want to take that or not.

But…i got some better hint…because Cubase struggles with projects from versions below 15. For me a bug; for others very normal. Tomorrow…tomorrow I will deal with that.

9

None of those are examples of “sidechaining” which happens with an actual compressor or limiter using two audio signals reacting to one or the other.

If you really NEED to do it, its time to buy some compressors and a mixing board and wire them up properly. Otherwise you wait until you’ve tracked everything and you use a software compressor and its “sidechain” feature while you are mixing.

10
11

I’ve been using Trigger Gate for years

12

I am having some difficulties to understand your setup & what exactly it is you are asking for.
Cubase has got a stock MIDI gate that can be triggered by a MIDI track to gate an audio track

I don’t think there’s any bug involved, btw.

A screenshot would be most helpful to understand your setup and where you get stuck.

13

Strange answer. I saw videos doing sidechain ducking or with gating/compressor … in Cubase. Audio on audio. Cubase-people seemingly don’t work with MIDI.

In my post, years ago, I got it…with MIDI. Don’t remember anymore, how. Because it was horrible, so I did it with my workstation. There this is an easy task, and I can do it as precise as I want it. My current pattern is in 1/32.

Now, MIDI track doesn’t appear on the list of sources.

One thing I found out: “source” can only be audio. Only then it appears in the source-list. My rendered MIDI track is seemingly not suitable. No effect. Now I have the problem, how to create a pattern with long & short signals; well defined. With MIDI…this wouldn’t be a problem.

At least I found, how to keep my original MIDI track when rendering. Last option kills it (“source events”). Anyway I would be interested how to restore it; would require the information, how it mutes it…to death.

Next step: asking an Ableton-man, whether that is a problem there to create a clean sidechain-effect…“clean” means MIDI…Signal on/off, exactly where I want it.

14

You keep saying “Bug”
I’ve read your comments.. trying to understand what you’re actually complaining about, what you’re trying to achieve and what is not working for you.
I’m guessing user error or maybe confusion certainly not “Bug”.

Are you trying to midi gate, trigger gate, side chain?.. Cubase does them (well) all in the box.
Maybe a clear description of what you’re trying to achieve will bring you constructive guidance.

15

You can do that with Cubase’s stock plugin (see my post above). There a various Youtube tutorials about that plugin out there. You will nead at least one audio track as @Monotremata pointed out.
As I said: Screenshots, please! This way it’s easy to identify what went wrong. Otherwise, you will keep on blaming Cubase for your user errors and we are getting nowhere.
Up to you.

EDIT: @Mrhehon beat me to it. That’s basically what I’m trying to say here, too.

16

Yes, but I didn’t see you asking for help.

17

Old Trance Gate effect. Rings some bells here…
As mentioned above.
Go to your synth track and add the MidiGate Plugin as insert effect.
Go to your gate trigger Midi track and change the Midi Output (left hand side inspector) to the MidiGate Midi input of the synth track. It should appear within the drop down list
Don’t use the standard side chain dialog at the top of each plugin. That is for audio only.
This might be the confusing part in this scenario, compared e.g.. to Ableton.

18

Nice hint. Thank you.

The description is perfect for people, who have to learn something ROFL “MidiGate, however, is not triggered by threshold levels, but MIDI notes. Therefore, it needs both audio and MIDI data to function.” Whatever this shall mean. It doesn’t need any Audio…at least not as a track of any kind. It shows all kind of tracks as a target.

It is exactly as I remember it: HORRIBLE. This is surely NOT the way to make a techno-ducking-pattern. Ridiculous.

19

Yeah. That’s the way I know this forum *thumbup

20

Dude, you should check on your attitude. So many kind people are trying to help you here.

Unless you contribute something constructive you can count me out.