System Breaks on Final Bar Lines

Hi All,

I’m just about to begin engraving 1 of 20 scores for a recording session that include short phrases/‘patches’ to cover 60s/30s edits at the end of each piece.

Usually, in Sibelius, I would create a page break in the main score between each ‘patch’ and that would automatically create system breaks in each part.

I am trying to find a way to create a system break in every part to separate each of these patches. But as these patches are only 4-8 bars in length, they can’t be on separate pages (unless we pay the price in printing costs…!) and we also don’t want to alter the frames for every part individually so separate flows aren’t an option.

I don’t suppose there’s some sort of tick box that I’ve missed that would allow me to automatically insert a system break to all layouts following a final barline…or something similar? Otherwise, I’ll stick the kettle on and prepare to manually insert 1300 system breaks…! :laughing:

Any help would be greatly appreciated!



Also, whilst I’m here…

I can’t find a way to re-assert the current time signature at the start of each ‘patch’ without a cautionary time signature appearing on the previous page/frame/system. As I am inputting final bar lines at the end of each patch, I am getting cautionary time signatures immediately following final bar lines.

Any solution to this would also be very useful :slight_smile:



To be honest I don’t quite understand why separate flows aren’t an option, but I may be missing something. On the Page Setup page of Layout Options you can allow new flows to start on existing pages. Using flows would also solve your problem with the time signatures.

I’m sharing Florian 's point of view. Flows are there exactly for that, so maybe you could tell us what the problem is with that solution?

Thanks very much for the replies - this seems to fix both the ‘system break’ and cautionary time signature issues.

In fairness, I didn’t mention this in my initial post but our plan is to import all 20 cues/pieces into a single Dorico project so that we can apply layout and engraving formatting to the entire project at once (as an ‘import house style’ equivalent doesn’t seem to exist yet). My concern would be that this would result in 80+ flows in the document, perhaps this would be fine?! (We are using a custom template but it will need altering/tweaking before printing).

In addition (perhaps this should be on a separate thread?), another problem with using flows (which is also a problem doing the Sibelius style system break method) is that there doesn’t seem to be an efficient way to automatically show each flow title before the music itself without manually creating them in engrave mode for each separate part. This would involve manually creating 5 titles for each of the approximately 300 parts across the whole album. We did think about creating a master page set for the part layouts that somehow include the titles but the individual part/patch lengths change between cues and instruments so we would still need to change these one by one.

Do you know of a way to achieve this? We are more than happy to change our work flow so any/all ideas are very welcome! :slight_smile:


You should definitely use separate flows for your project. The only real problem I would expect you to encounter would be that if you need to change the order of the flows, once you have 80 flows in a project, the Flows panel in Setup mode is not very practical for making changes across that number of flows. We plan to add some better features to help with management of large numbers of flows in future.

Unfortunately the problem where Dorico cannot show a title and other front matter for a flow that starts midway down a page is a more significant problem: the program has no feature to automatically show front matter before a flow, but this is something that we are certainly going to add as soon as we can. It’s non-trivial because we want to provide you with some control over what should appear, how it should be formatted, and so on, so we want to make it possible to define a mini-template, a set of frames with tokens etc. like you have at the top of the ‘First’ master page, and get Dorico to insert that automatically.

Thanks very much for your response, Daniel!

I’m looking forward to being able to add titles and front matter before flows, especially in very small flows such as exercises and our ‘patches’. I’m sure this would also be very useful to someone making a large workbook with a few hundred exercises, for example.

Using flows seems to work very well so In the meantime, we will have to keep each flow on a separate page as we can’t afford the time to add titles individually to each layout!

Cheers :slight_smile:

Unless you need the titles to be horizontally centered you could add them as system text that’s attached to the first note of each flow. It would show in each layout. You’d probably need to do some manual repositioning in Engrave Mode, but it’s certainly less laborious than adding frames.