Trouble removing beats from bars

I’m trying to remove some beats from the last bar of a flow.

Screenshot

When I do this, nothing happens. If I place the caret at the start of the bar, then the note gets deleted, but the total number of beats in the bar remains the same.

If I try in other bars, then I also get deleted notes, and the following notes move up to take their place (Insert is OFF), but again, no change to the number of beats in the bar.

I’ve tried -2q as well as -1h, and there’s no difference. Also, +2q adds a minim rest, but does not change the meter.

I’ve even read the help pages! And as far as I can see, I’m doing what it says, but not getting the result.

https://steinberg.help/dorico_pro/v3.5/en/dorico/topics/notation_reference/notation_reference_bars/notation_reference_bars_deleting_t.html

It specifically says “You can delete specific beats, … for example, to shorten the last bar in flows that start with pick-up bars.”

Of course, I can just change it to 2/4 and hide it, to get the result I want.

Ben,

This might do: select the first rest to delete.
Shift B top open pop-over.
Insert |] and click OK (Enter).

Jan

That does work: though I’m not sure why just adding a barline should delete beats. (If I add the barline on beat 2, I get a split bar, rather than a shortened one.)

I’m also more focused on understanding how Dorico works here, rather than achieving the goal. !

Of course I don’t know what is going on underneath the surface but it seems that with inserting the (final) barline there is also a Trim Flow activated. That only if there had not been any notes in or after the first rest you want to be deleted. Otherwise indeed there will be a split bar and you have to do the Trim Flow by hand.
So far what I have seen what ‘s going on.

My apologies @benwiggy, I remember this coming up a little while ago that this doesn’t work in the last bar in flows as I described in the manual. Either I was simply entirely mistaken when I tried this out myself (as I definitely remember doing that!) or there’s been a subtle change at some point since then. It’s on my list to correct, as obviously that’s not great to have in the manual when it doesn’t work as described.

Thanks, @Lillie_Harris, but the behaviour in the last bar actually seems to be the same as other bars: you (I) can’t actually delete or add beats to a bar.

It works for open meter: +2q will add beats to that bar. But for standard meters, it just inserts rests (or deletes the notes) without changing the number of beats (unless there’s another time sig later on.)

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There’s a level of complexity in that it will add/remove the specified number of beats’ worth of music at the very least, and will add/remove rhythmic time to/from the flow - but won’t leave a partial final bar.

Inserting beats won’t expand a bar within a prevailing time signature, you’re right - music gets pushed/pulled beyond the established barlines set by the time signature.

If I may, I’d suggest that the page I linked needs to clarify the behaviour of open metre bars versus ‘actual’ metre, and include some instructions for how to shorten the final bar. (Tag ‘anacrucis’ !)

Thank you, yes as I said I know it needs revision. It’s on the list.

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