Yes, I realise that the keyswitches for GPO instruments will be different from those for HSO - that’s why I changed the pizz keyswitch in my new cello map, as described above. As I said, I can’t tally the GPO KSs in the manual with the descriptions for the HSO KSs, and I don’t really understand what they’re all for. The only thing I need to get right is to enable the volume to be controlled in the mixer.
I may be able to use your GPO5 maps, if you would be happy to let me try them please?
They should be on the linked page in my first reply.
Thanks Ben - I have loaded your library now. However, I’m now finding that no matter what changes I make substituting one map for another in the endpoint setup dialog, it doesn’t seem to make any difference to the sounds I’m hearing. Even if I revert to the Default map I started with I’m still getting the pizz sound I was originally looking for! If only there were some kind of tutorial in which all this is properly explained, it would save so much time …
There are lots of different tutorials about how to work with expression maps in Dorico, but none of them are specifically related to GPO5. Try this video and this one for example.
Alternatively, please feel free to provide more specifics about the nature of the problem you’re experiencing, and we should be able to help solve it. A minimal sample project including the expression map you’ve set up and a few notes to demonstrate what’s wrong would probably be sufficient.
Many thanks for your attention.
Using Dorico Elements 3.5
I need pizzicato strings in a piece I’m working on, but the strings in HALion SE don’t have keyswitches. I’m therefore trying to use my existing Garritan Personal Orchestra instruments. Thanks to the help from the other guys above, I’ve finally managed to get access to the GPO instruments via Kontact VST, but of course I need to use suitable expression maps to invoke pizzicato and other effects. I’m struggling to understand how to create an expression map for the GPO instruments, because I don’t understand properly how the keyswitches and controls work, and I can’t tie up the effects in the HSO maps, as examples, with the ones listed in the GPO manual. I’ve loaded in the maps provided by Ben, above, but I’m finding that switching from one map to another doesn’t seem to affect the sounds I’m getting. It’s almost as though I have to close Dorico and restart it to make the changes ‘stick’. As you can see the problem is in the chair - not the computer! I need to do some learning.
Ed, provided the patches you’re loading into Kontakt provide a means to change the patch, e.g. by way of a keyswitch or MIDI controller change, then you should be OK: my memory of GPO is dim (I’ve not used it in close to 15 years) but I seem to recall that there are patches with KS in the name, which denote that they are key switch patches, so at that point you should be able to match up the pitches provided in the GPO documentation with what you need to enter in the Play > Expression Maps dialog.
I seem to be getting some control over the effects eg pizz now, by applying an expression map with the correct keyswitch in place. However I have another problem, which is how to apply control changes. I just don’t understand what the Control Change or Program Change elements are for in the expression map, or how they work. At the moment, even with HALion SE instruments, only one of the instruments in my piece are controllable with the sliders in the mixer - the others have the green bars at zero, regardless of the slider position. Clearly something is missing or wrong in my setup.
Thanks for the suggestions on tutorials. Unfortunately, there doesn’t seem to be anything about CC or PC. Maybe I need a different tutorial?
CCs are used by the sample controller in two ways: either on/off switches (with the threshold at 64); or as a floating value.
For switches, it’s easy enough to set Playing Techniques to turn stuff on and off, e.g. Legato, Mute, etc.
For floating values, like Vibrato intensity, you’ll have to draw that data yourself in the CC lane. The only floating value CC info that Dorico can provide automatically is dynamic volume.
Thanks for this. So what would be the purpose of adding a CC in the expression map. Is it supposed to control the volume in some way? Sorry to be dense, but I just don’t see how it works. I’m not finding that making changes in the dynamic lane has any effect, which makes me think that I don’t have the right stuff in the expression map.
Also, can anyone please help with the mixer? Only one instrument (a flute) in my setup is actually showing any action in the mixer, although all are actually playing!
An Expression map maps “Dynamics” to CC1 (or whatever the library uses). It maps “legato” to CC68.
What have you set Volume to use in the “Natural” base of your Map?
As for the mixer: you’ve got all the instruments playing back from the VST on the same output channel. You need to set each instrument to a different pair of output channels, then they will be controllable in Dorico’s mixer as separate things. Currently, you’ve got one slider controlling all the instruments.
Thanks for this. I’m sure you’re right, but I have no idea how to set output channels. I thought it was in the Endpoint dialog, but I have eight instruments with the channels set to 1 - 8, and I ticked the box for no of audio outputs to show in mixer, and set it to 8, but I still only get the one active channel in the mixer. There just doesn’t seem to be anywhere where it tells you how to set this up correctly. It’s so frustrating!
Regarding the volume, there is no ‘Natural’ Base on the map I’m using which is a duplicate HSO Cello Solo.
I’m afraid I don’t understand what you mean by ‘An Expression map maps “Dynamics” to CC1 (or whatever the library uses). It maps “legato” to CC68.’ How can I actually see that in a map?
Here’s my GPO Strings map. On the right had side, you’ll see that Volume dynamic is set to use CC1. So Dorico’s dynamics are mapped to the range 1 to 127 on CC1. The Legato expression will map Legato on off in Dorico to CC68 on/off for the VST.
The Natural Base expression uses key switch C in the octave -2. (Using C3 as middle C)
As for the outputs: you have to configure those in the VST instrument itself, not in Dorico.
Ed,
As Ben mentions in his final sentence, to get more than one channel in the mixer (one for each track/sound) you have to set up a multi-output in your VST. Garritan’s Aria Multi has the ability to do that, as do recent versions of Kontakt, although one has to view some youTube videos and experiment a little to manage that.
What version of Kontakt are you using?
Thanks for this Ben. I can see the assignment of volume dynamics to CC1, and also the keyswitch for Natural, but where is the mapping for Legato? There doesn’t seem to be a Legato expression listed.
OK, thanks Derrek. I’ll look for a tutorial on multi-output for Kontact. BTW, I don’t have multi-output working for HALion SE either. Can’t see where this is supposed to be configured for either VST.
You need to create a mapping for Legato. That list of Init, Accent, Downbow, Detaché, Muted… etc - you have to add each of those and specify the CCs.
There’s a + at the bottom of the list.
Have you watched the video of John Barron making the Expression Map for BBC SO? That shows you exactly how to set this all up: the only difference is what CCs Garritan uses for each style.
Thanks again, Ben.
I’ve been switching around between HALion and Kontact and getting more and more confused, so I decided to set up a new project, and import the MIDI file I had exported from Overture - the notation software I used to use.
I was very careful about setting up all the instruments in the right order in the Kontact player, and creating and assigning output channels for all of them. I then imported the expression maps I’d made in the other project and assigned them to the instruments.
However, although I’ve created 8 outputs in Kontact (st1 - st8) and assigned them to the eight instruments I have, and the mixer is correctly showing Kt st1 for the channel 1 instrument, the flute, it’s showing Ktaux1 - Ktaux 4 for the next four instruments and Ku[ for all of the next three, and the labels in the mixer don’t all tie up with the instruments being played. Moreover, the sliders in the mixer don’t seem to have much effect for the strings, although mute does work for the woodwind. I’m using my own expression maps for the strings, so that makes me suspicious!
The display in the mixer doesn’t seem to bear much relation to what’s going on.
Any more help please? I’m really finding this integration with Kontact problematic. The instruments just don’t show up in any meaningful way in the mixer - some of them seem to have two channels there. Furthermore, although I’ve made the CC#1 setting for volume in the expression maps, I have no control at all over dynamics with the channels in the Play tab.
Make sure that you have connected the expression maps you’ve created with the appropriate channel in Kontakt Player using the Endpoint Setup dialog.