VST3i is supported on all CPUs and OSes, and in my DAWs, but HSSE3 crashes on install

Virtual instruments HALion
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Software developer post.

This is mostly from the HSSE3 installer using an instruction that crashes it. It’s related to compatibility and dropping VST2 support for Mac, see related thread (apparently I can’t link even internal forum URLs, but it has title cubase-12-and-vst2-support and number 748993.)

My thought is that it’s completely unnecessary to use an instruction with poor backwards compatibility for an installer. It’s either on purpose or by mistake from the devs. Either way it’s just a click on a compiler flag away to let an installer finish its job of decompressing files onto an SSD.

Now the backstory: I bought a Yamaha MG16XU mixer which I’m happy with, and one of my subs on Youtube tipped me off to a free VST3i, but without HSSE3, my DAWs can’t use it. They use VST3s just fine.

I mean it’s not a big deal, I’ll live without a single free instrument. But Steinberg could have had HSSE3installed on my computer in case I was offered an instrument for purchase in future.

Some of us have also invested time and money into a rig with several years of content we can’t discard for the sake of one purveyor, which then risks customers discarding incompatible purveyors instead.

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Really? You didn’t even mention on which platform you’re working?

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Windows. If the Intel Mac installer is made with the same thought towards breaking backwards compatibility, it could affect OS X also. It could well be that the software to be installed is compatible; it’s quite unusual to make an installer not compatible as it performs a simple job. It’s said that the Intel Mac HSSE3 supports VST2, which is much older than my CPU.

No software can be future-compatible, only backwards compatible. Hence M1 Macs and the helpdesk information on which Steinberg products are affected if you update. One break in backwards compatibility leads to another as we see, and that’s why I think it’s best to be as backwards compatible as you can.

Apple obviously breaks compatibility to push product; they don’t care if they lose customers along the way. It’s not quite the same for standalone software. You don’t have to reinstall the entire computer and set up all the stuff you use again including non-music software (this can take a week or more full time for some of us). You can’t really go “my way or the highway” like Apple - unless you use the same methods of tying software with hardware with dongles and licenses and steering customers towards a monopoly.

The cost of a new computer could be an issue, but it’s the threat of reinstalling everything that is the major deterrent. Where there’s competition, the customer has options, and so it’s likely that a break in compatibility (again, there’s only backwards compatibility) steers customers to software that works on the computer where they have all their other (music) software.

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Bla bla bla…
this is a Steinberg user forum, maybe you could post your suggestions on facebook?

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It’s exactly where the post belongs. The guy cannot install the HALion player and has a good theory on what causes the problem.

Hopefully one of the programmers, or some user on Beta team will put his post in the JIRA thinggy (if it’s not already been discovered and pointed out).

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Yes very detailed description…
Windows
that is all the information… btw HSSE is installed on my system, Windows… no problems here

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I think we’re talking past each other? As stated initially this is a software dev post. As in obviously I’d like to use the software, but I see a simple mistake that could be easily fixed.

If the current HSSE3 installer works for you, it’s because your CPU, like mine, is supported by Windows: versions are the same OS from Win7 - Win11 with very minor differences, all with great CPU support.

The problem is the compiler flag, as also stated initially. It can be set to support the CPUs Windows supports in five minutes, and a recompile later the installer works on Windows. There are no crash reporters in installers (all OSes, all devices) because they are normally written to complete installation safely. A few heavy compute libraries and the like might need specialized instructions. I think it’s just a mistake.

The alternative and the worry, though, is that it’s on purpose. The languages, frameworks, and libraries that devs use precisely to avoid getting involved in CPU instructions were written to be backwards-compatible, and that’s exactly what makes them future-proof. But I’ve seen some text on the website regarding this, which reads as though going with recent changes is future-proofing. This is obviously incorrect. All it does is shed support while supplying no future-proofing. Now if this was from above and the devs did as they were told, they are not to blame, ofc. They simply implemented the project change. For an installer it’s an unusual move, though.

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Sorry, but without any further information on the system the installer fails, this is just ranting.

I use more than one system and help some people with their DAW, and nobody has this fault.
We all use different systems with different CPU’s and with slightly different architecture…
But HSSE installs just fine on all of them.

This indicates that you have no idea what you are talking about.

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How long ago? Since the Dorico 4 release and changes for the new Licenser system?

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It’s very hard to stand up against some of the fanbois here. It’s not worth it.

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Last install was last week.

But if you download the HSSE only, why should the Dorico 4 release change anything in HSSE?
Do you have problems as well?

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And this implies that ‘you have no idea what you’re talking about’.

HSSE 3.5 is HSSE 3.5, regardless of the host it’s shipped with, or if you get it ‘free’.

Personally, I am still running 3.4. It works fine for me as I still have my dongle set up. I need the dongle for Cubase, H6, GA5, bunch of dongle keyed sound content, and more anyway. Others aren’t taking the same path though. They want the new licensing system NOW. That means they must take the 3.5 HSSE update as well if they want to keep using HSSE, HSO, and Olympus sounds with dorico.

Steinberg is rolling out a new dongle free system. Dorico uses this, and the newest HSSE supports it as well. So, new Dorico 4 people, or those upgrading from 3.5 or earlier are going to be grabbing it if they want off their ‘dongles or software eLicensers’.

I have had a BUNCH of issues over the years (with every single software product I’ve ever used…bar none), and in particular since the Dorico 4 roll out, and some have been with HALion or GA in recent weeks, so yes. I have ‘theories’ as to where the problems are too, and my theories could be so wrong it’s side splitting funny to the programmers ‘in the know’. Still, they’re usually glad to get the reports since they spend time ‘making this stuff and not USING it’, and things do get past them.

Already reported and acknowledged by people at Steinberg and they have people ‘on it’. I’ve had fewer issues getting Dorico 4 running than some others I know because I also run Cubase 11 here, and happen to own H6 and had all that installed as well. So I personally skipped grabbing the HSSE 3.5 related stuff when I upgraded to Dorico 4. Some others it seems have not been so lucky!

I also had some issues with GA5 (or maybe it’s GA SE, it was confusing, ended up with duplicate sets of some GA SE presets, and it took a lot of redoing installations to get it sorted) installers fairly recently, as have some others.

It may well be that OP is totally wrong on his theory over what’s causing him from getting HSSE free working. He might even be a troll or something, but it seems to me like he’s just trying to be helpful.

At any rate, people really do have isolated issues that never show up for others. Seems this guy might have had similar happen in the past, so experience has taught him something about how to trace the issue on his system.

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That could be… but where is all the useful information about his system?
If he is talking about compiler flags and CPU compatibility, I would expect that he mentions his CPU model, at least.
Instead, he is speculating about VST2 support and macOS? Why?
He isn’t specifying his OS in the initial post.

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He’s explained why he made the post at least 3 times now, including in the OP. [He believes] the installers have been configured to FAIL if they don’t like the target system. That means you get zero chance to try to sort out whatever the problem is as an end user (if there even is a problem. It might run quite fine if you can get it to install!) !

It’s not installing, and then crashing with logs and stuff to see what’s up. It’s simply deciding 'Nope, not gonna run on this system. Not gonna install it. Sorry. Goodbye." OP is concerned with this, and to be honest, if what he says is true, I am too!

All it really needs to do, as the OP suggests, is check, “Is this windows? Yep. OK…I’ll unpack this stuff and install it. Good luck, hope it all runs for you. I see you have Windows installed, so off I go! Done my job!”

Instead, OP is suggesting it’s getting more ‘picky’ and will fail for a plethora of potential reasons…to even INSTALL the software.

If it means nothing to you, and you’re not a forum mod, why not just let it go?

If you are a forum mod, there are still much better ways to deal with it (quietly move the post to the Lounge and send the user a PM about why it was moved).

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My SDA logs

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It’s all speculation what’s happened on his side… this information is lacking as well.
The installers write logs, normally. And they throw messages if something fails. Normally.

But his report is not a real report, that’s the main point here… it’s just speculation, rumour and ranting. With his first post.

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The ‘ranting’ is coming from you. You don’t like what someone had to say. You’re not bringing anything helpful to the table. You’re just attacking his post.

People have opinions and post them here all the time. Call them ‘rants’ if you like, but in this case it’s on a line that some might consider off topic, while others will not.

Understand, a lot of people are upset about some announcements over VST2 support, and with good reason. Blowback is to be expected.

We’ll all have to see how it shakes out in the long term, but in the here and now, people are truly AFRAID of things they fear ‘might happen’ over the next year or two. They should be lifting their voices while they still can.

Now maybe a lot of the ‘fear’ is an over-reaction, but that’s going to remain until more clarity is released over the issue.

I say, let them rant…
I’ve seen dozens of posts on the issue, I read most them but don’t chime in on them all.

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Those are installer logs. Not logs from HSSE that never got installed!

Point was that the user never get to even try launching the software. Installer decided for him.

This is BAD for many many reasons. No virtual machine deployment (or it’ll be a heck of a lot harder) for instance.

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So, what do you think is his issue?
He was trying to install a piece of software and the installer fails to do so. It stops the install. On Windows. And his first suggestion is to set some compiler flags because the installer is not working on Windows in general? And it must have something to do with dropping VST2 support on MacOS?

But he never mentioned what really happened exactly.

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My interpretation is that he has experience with building installers. He wanted to install HSSE at the recommendation of his buddy so he tried it.

It failed, so he went into the logs and figured out why.

He came here to suggest that some changes in the installer setup would be a good idea. If it was an ‘accident’ please fix it.

If it was done ‘on purpose’, get ready for a hell storm of pissed off people who can no longer use this software.

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Where is the storm of disappointed users of the installer for Halion Sonic SE?

I highly doubt that he figured out why the installer failed…

One more question: Why does he use the installer? Why not use SDA?
And, most important, if he has a problem, and needs help, why he do not ask for help?