Why does Dorico interfere with my music when I try to insert a triplet?

Hello everyone,

I’m having trouble adding Triplet in Dorico and wonder if I’m doing something wrong or if it’s a bug.

In Picture 1, I’m trying to select a note and use the “:” shortcut to enter a 3:2 ratio for my triplet.
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In Picture 2, Dorico inserts the triplet but pushes my music to the next bar and ties the last note of the triplet to the next bar. This is very strange.

In Picture 3, I figured out that the only way to create a triplet correctly is to delete the notes, select the rest, and add the triplet using the pop-over. This way, I have the triplet precisely without any issues.
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If there is a specific process I should follow, please assist me. I am feeling overwhelmed.

Thank you

Have you tried creating the tuplet while in input mode?

When you’re in the Selection Mode, my understanding is that Dorico will transform the M next notes/rests from the score and cast them into the duration of N notes (for a M:N tuplet). And in Input Mode, it will transform N notes into M divisions (adding rests if necessary). That’s my understanding but feel free to correct me if I’m wrong

Please see this thread and/or this thread. There were new features in Dorico 4 to handle more cases.

@Lillie_Harris - the documentation on this topic is (IMHO) at best confusing and at worst incomplete. eg. There is no mention on this page about the need use note-input mode to get the correct result.

Would there be space somewhere for a technical description (with examples) of exactly how Dorico treats the conversion of existing notes to tuplets (I find it can easily produce unexpected results)?

Is insert mode activated?

Insert mode appears to have no affect on the conversion of the tuplet notes themselves, but may affect subsequent notes, especially if they are “dragged back” into the tuplet.

I find the behaviour unpredictable (in that I can’t anticipate what will happen, but might be able to post-rationalise once it has happened - if that makes any sense?)

I experimented with this again just now, and the behavior is predictable to me. Without the stop line:

  • Adding a normal (contracting ratio) tuplet to existing notes grabs the following notes that will fill the numerator’s value, and leaves a rest after:
    Leaves Gap

  • If it’s an expanding ratio such as 2:3, notes beyond the numerator’s duration get pushed to the right:
    Overlap

And of course the stop line prevents the following notes from being taken into a tuplet – even if insert mode is on.

I tried with on and off it wont matter

It worked, but it still feels strange to switch to input mode to change it to a tuplet. Thank you.

Yes, but that is not how it is explained in the documentation.

And does not explain why the final two semis here are not tuplified…
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I remember when I was learning to fly an airplane and finally got my certification, but still felt nervous when flying solo. My instructor said, “The process means you are safe; it doesn’t guarantee you are comfortable.” :smirk:

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I’ll put it on my list for review.

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The popover makes only as many tuplets as there are notes in the selection to fill them. In your example selecting one more 16th would yield three triplets and no leftovers.

To quote the manual: "If the selected notes fit into a single tuplet of the specified ratio, only a single tuplet is created. If the selected notes do not fit into a single tuplet, as many tuplets as required are created automatically "[my emphasis]

Yeah, so the meaning of “required” is debatable here.