Add Element (Line, Text, etc.) w/o affecting layout

[Michael_Cuthbert]

Hello, I was wondering if there is a way to add elements such as lines, text/system text, etc. in Write mode in such a way that Dorico does not allocate spacing (vertical especially) for the element added. In this way I’d like the program to behave more like simpler programs like Finale.

In the attached excerpt, I have made a pretty good layout with everything entered in Write and then tweaked in Engrave, but then realized just at the end that I want to show the piano’s highest line as a “vi5–6” motion with system text and a line connecting 5–6. Resulting in the first image.

In Finale and other software before Dorico, I could add the Text (Shift-X) and the Line and the program would not allocate extra space between staves, so it’d be up to me to find a way to make the layout work: sometimes that’d be a real pain, so Dorico’s method would save time. In this case, and what seems like a majority of cases so far, there is enough room to add the text and the line withou increasing the spacing between staves. So after I’ve tweaked things in Engrave I get something like the second image, which has much too much space between the two instruments because extra space that wasn’t needed was allocated. So I’m going to need to go back to staff spacing and fix the layouts (sometimes Lyric placement also)

I there any way to turn Dorico intelligence off for a bit and let me add lines, text, ornaments, etc. without making any room for them, and if for some reason I bet wrong, to let me add the additional space? I understand why the tech crew would like to emphasize the intelligence of the system, but sometimes a lobotomy is the best way forward.

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Image 1: vi5, 6, and line just added in Write mode to correctly spaced parts.

Image 2: vi5, 6, and line positioned properly in Engrave mode showing excessive space between parts.

Image 3: The correct spacing before vi and line were added restored via manual tweaking to text and lines:

Thanks for everything!

[Damian_leGassick]

@Michael_Cuthbert

I there any way to turn Dorico intelligence off for a bit and let me add lines, text, ornaments, etc. without making any room for them,

I wish…

[pianoleo]

But there is.

Select the Text object, go to Engrave mode, and you’ll find an “Avoids Collisions” property. Turn its switch on but leave its tickbox unticked.

(The switch is overriding the global default for this object, which is in Library > Engraving Options > Text - you could turn it off globally here. The turned off tickbox is telling that individual item to not avoid collisions regardless of the global setting for text objects).

Alternatively you can tell Layout Options > Vertical Spacing to not avoid collisions between staves and systems. This’ll be more useful for ornaments and lines etc., which don’t necessarily have local properties for avoiding or not avoiding collisions, but it’s all or nothing (it affects the whole Layout).

[Damian_leGassick]

@pianoleo

but it’s all or nothing

and that’s exactly the issue at hand here regarding lines.

[pianoleo]

If the Line is semantically attached to the right notes (in the first screenshot above it’s double the length it should be), and the text has collision avoidance turned off, the chances are that the text will collide with the Line but not much vertical space will be created, as it’s only the vertical height around the Line that’s factored in.

I’ve not had time to try it, but I suspect if you tried it you’d find that I’m correct here.

An alternative method would be to build a bank of these harmonic analysis objects as Playing Techniques, then put them on the page and group them together. That way they’ll line up nicely - as the line is actually part of the Playing Technique - and won’t create extra vertical space.

[Damian_leGassick]

@pianoleo

build a bank of these harmonic analysis objects as Playing Techniques

This is absolutely the best way for doing this kind of annotation in Dorico that I can think of, but a new playing technique for every different annotation? Depends on the context - it could work.

I’ve got two large academic harmony/analysis textbooks to typeset next year and so far Dorico isn’t tempting me. It’s not that you can’t get there, but the constant battle with Dorico trying to be ‘helpful’ and ‘clever’ and ‘semantic’ is a workflow killer for me (it’s brilliant for other things, that goes without saying).

[EDIT I’m not even sure that you can do the OP’s n5----6 marking as a Playing Technique. Two text markings, one with superscript and an extensible line? I would love to know if there is a trick for this - I would definitely use it.]