Adjusting initial clef and key/time signature spacing in a single flow

I’m looking to increase the spacing between the time signature and the key signature, and also to shift the initial clef slightly to the right — not globally, but only once, in a single flow within a document that contains multiple flows.

This is for educational purposes, as I’d like to draw a box around the clef and key signature (not the time signature).

Is this possible, or is there a workaround?

Been experimenting a bit, but no good solution, I’m afraid.

Jesper

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Thanks for trying.

Welcome to the forum, @datal!
With a rather complicated workaround, it is possible to make clefs, key signatures, and time signatures movable wherever you want. But it’s quite tricky to explain, so it would be better to know exactly what you’re trying to achieve first!

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Brilliant.

Jesper

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I think I was having a similar idea with an invisible clef, hidden time sig and no key sig (not C-major in case this would have to be shown for a transposing instrument) and then adding clef, key sig and time sig as playing techniques. The first bar is empty (rest hidden) and I hid the barline (change it to tick and set Tick adj. both to -1/2 in the properties). Then increase the spacing for the first bar in Note spacing mode in Engrave, reposition clef, key sig and time sig and enter a bar number change on bar 2 (if you need bar numbers). You’ll have to add the clef and key signature again (as an actual clef and KS) on the next system.

Also quite complicated. Yours looks a bit more elaborate to set up, but it seems more flexible once you’re done with that.

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I thought he meant just for one staff.

Jesper

Wow! This looks like a very elegant solution. I, however (being pretty new to Dorico) can’t get my signposts to show (except for systems breaks, frame breaks, and C major). I see you have multiple signposts for 4/4. How do you do that! Looks like magic. :slight_smile:

I basically want to do what your video shows.

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Well, here is a short demo, please ask if something is not clear (I had to go very fast so the video is not too heavy to be uploadable here!)

Updated:

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Thank you so much, this looks amazing. It’ll take me a while to navigate a whole thing, I’ll let you know how I get on.

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Refresh this page, the new video is better than the previous one :wink:

One last thing: if bar numbering matters, you’ll need to do the following, as @Zalde was mentionning: select the signposts of the first three time signatures, and in the properties panel, switch on Group first bar as pickup, and tick the blank square. Then your first bar with music will be number one.

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Thank you so, so much - I did it, complete with bar numbering change. I have learned to much. You are my hero @charles_piano .

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Here is a different approach:

The first system has a treble clef with an octave indicator. The Edit Music Symbol dialog is used to replace the glyph for this clef with a horizontal glyph which will be hidden inside a staff line followed after a gap by the normal treble clef. The first system also has a custom key signature with three normal flats and a new accidental containing a flat followed after a gap by a horizontal glyph which will be hidden inside a staff line. The second system has a hidden coda, the normal treble clef and the usual key signature with four flats.

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Thank you @johnkprice, it looks good. My knowledge of Dorico won’t allow me to reproduce this at this stage. Are all the signposts showing? That might help me I think. Otherwise, I’m sure I’ll work it out in time.

Yes, only one signpost is necessary.