Cubase for Linux

I haven’t read all the replies…but…

Ahh…the ever old Cubase-Linux threads… :smiley:

They got burned super bad by BeOS and they will NEVER port to …well… RC Cola when Coke and Pepsi are just fine.

Putting ideological issues aside (companies are run by people with worldviews, too), such as the benefit to society of helping free software platforms thrive and decoupling people from their need for closed source operating systems under centralized, corporate control, there are also practical concerns.

Audio setups are delicate things, and among the most dreadful scenarios is the situation when something “magically” starts working differently, which usually constitutes “not working”, because it means things don’t go the way you want them to. Maybe even the entire audio workstation stops working altogether. To prevent that, there are people who actually freeze their workstation, rendering the computer in question a mostly monolithic, quite sophisticated instrument or other tool for music production. For those that do it, it is of course advisable to keep those machines off the network and swap equipment with networked computers with sanitization in mind.

This plays into the corner of having control over your machine and what happens to its setup. The Linux ecosystem is known to provide an amount of control and a wealth of options unparalleled in the world of Windows and the Macintosh, which is why it is flourishing in applications that go far beyond from just “servers”, ranging from fridges and city information terminals to infrastructure and warships.

A number of people in this thread have stated that they couldn’t care less what the underlying operating system was. Whilst some of them might be worried about Steinberg’s resources getting spread too thin, the malleability of a Linux environment would make for a system that’d easily hold stable for more than a decade, even across hardware maintenance, enabling the user to run an audio workstation much more dedicated to the task than what Microsoft or Apple are willing to provide in this day and age. It’d also cut down on overall workstation acquisition cost.

This could go as far as Steinberg being able to explore new product lines, from a dedicated Cubase Linux distribution for an out of the box, full blown audio workstation experience (perhaps even a USB dongle based “live” system; just “stick & go”) to dedicated hardware driven by their own platform, completely geared towards their customer base and beyond.

Regarding Linux flavour support, no one expects a company to support the entire variety of Linux distributions. Being an extremely healthy, free flowing ecosystem, there are simply too many for any one entity to offer quality support for every single one of them.
Instead, Steinberg could decide to support a distribution that fits their products and customer base the best, and expand to others only if they deem it prudent to do so. A good choice would perhaps be a flavour with stable long term support options.

Welcome to the forum, Aziroshin, and thank you for “getting” the idea of Cubase on Linux!

I also have to applaud Aziroshin for that comment!
Let’s remember that Linux was initially developed as a derivative to Unix… THE first OS with a GUI - and without that, none of these other OS’s would’ve existed not Amiga, not Windows, not Mac… none!!! The two big brothers (Win and Mac) start with a piece of code called a ‘kernel’, very much the same as that which all other OS’s start off, including Linux. And, as far as the “flavor” (or distro), it really doesn’t matter. As long as either 1) the kernel supports the hardware/software - or - 2) there are drivers written compatible to the kernel. For the most part, the Linux kernel is pretty standard across the distro’s.
I have contacted Steinberg about this several times and they finally answered me with this: “While this is not in our plans at the moment, it may be something they would consider in the future.” Anybody with software experience may already know that the “Android” OS IS, IN FACT, ‘Linux’ on a mobile device :nerd: , yet they ARE developing for Android! THINK!!!
Oh… and, as far as that previous comment about Linux having a lack of market share?! HELLO :bulb: , think about it!.. it’s free!!! You’re not going to see shares! And the companies with the ‘big shoulders’ aren’t going to want the consumers to know about ‘free’ stuff because it takes away from their sales. Which, by the way, we’ve seen a decline in Win PC purchases with no gain on the Mac side. However, there has been an increase in PAD/Tablet/Phone sails, with the majority of those sales (by unit, not price) going to Android units… so, now, we come full circle - who’s got the “market share”?! :wink:

Which is why Windows 10 is going to be FREE and out this year. I would HATE HATE HATE to use Cubase on an Android pad computer and by the way, I tried the Steinberg Android app and it totally sucks. It is a piece of crap app.

Yes Linux is free but buying a new audio device and midi device is not free. It’s VERY expensive. I love my new RME Babyface and my old MOTU midi i/o.

Since so few people use Linux for serious music work, it would be a really stupid business decision to waste time and money on this. Not enough consumer audio devices support it anyway.

When Steinberg releases their first console for the HoloLens, you are going to see a lot of people switching from Apple to Microsoft. If they are smart, Steinberg is working on this now. They are big on skeuomorphism anyway,

Linux by itself can have a light footprint on resources, but often this means strip down anything you do not need.

Graphics, disk I/O, mathematical calculations run smooth on windows as on Linux. All these operating systems are pretty good these days.

However the support for audio devices, midi devices, dongles, VST, VSTi’s, DX, AAX, UA will NOT BE SUPPORTED by the great audio companies! And if they will wait for at least 3 years before enough stable products are available. While I like Linux for server duties like web servers, database servers, I really stay away from it when it comes to advanced tools like DAW and video editing systems.

Once again, a sweeping statement for which there is absolutely no supporting evidence. Since the spread of iOS, almost every audio device brought to market is class-compliant, meaning it will work out-of-the-box in Linux as well.

If major companies choose not to support their devices, then there is a much larger open-source support network out there. Personally, I simply don’t buy peripherals if the manufacturer is actively blocking the development of open-source drivers under Linux. If others don’t care about that, then fine … none of it presents a reason against offering Cubase for Linux as an option for others.

Regarding the “market share” argument, Microsoft are about to give away their next OS free, so technically it’s hard to argue that it will have any market share (market = $$$) … by that rationale Steinberg should stop development of Cubase for Windows 10 as it will have effectively zero “market share”.

Graphical software is about to undergo a revolution. When your virtual high definition monitor is the the size of your entire wall, you won’t have to switch windows anymore. The HoloLens is going to change everything.

Wow! Didn’t know that. As far as I know the first GUI systems for Unix were W and SGI IRIS (both 1983). Before them there were GUIs in Xerox systems (Alto 1973, Star 1981) and even Apple Lisa shipped before first IRIS system (W never really was widely available). What am I missing?

Well there is more, VAX-VMS had a GUI around 1980.

Once again, a sweeping statement for which there is absolutely no supporting evidence. Since the spread of iOS, almost every audio device brought to market is class-compliant, meaning it will work out-of-the-box in Linux as well.

Not looking for a endless discussion here, but my thoughts where with the whole 32/64 bit and vst debacle, how long did it took for the great audio companies to get this broad available? I wouldn’t say it is impossible to get broad support for UNIX OS. But think again how much variants of Lunix there are and how are all the companies going to support this and make some money meanwhile?

Maybe some of us have good faith, but down to earth with me I say: won’t happen! :mrgreen:

Mid-way through Windows 7, if someone had said the next version of Windows was going to be so bad, they’d fire the boss of Microsoft and give the next version away for free as compensation, many would have considered that crazy talk.

A new OS is NOT a zero cost, at least for those whose time means something to them!

I think you are losing touch with the ground here, as your ‘facts’ are dubious or plain wrong, and your arguments are getting as specious as what you are accusing others of.

Raw numbers of disparate devices is NOT the same as a unified target OS to develop to, especially if requiring near real-time low-latency multi-streaming. Relevant stats required, which is what SB would be wanting well up front.

If you could afford one of those systems, you could afford to pay other people to record you, and let them be the ones who have OS angst!

The full Cubase is not a couple of apps running on underpowered hardware. Putting it on Linux, as it would be expected to be a full version, is a whole other level of development to its current effort for those OSs. Perspective required here.

I bet SB has already sounded out this issue many times over the years, and it probably always came down to expected ROI being too low.

I suspect that OSX, given its current numbers, would not provide the required ROI for a DAW maker if it did not already have its substantial history in the field. That is, if OSX was a DAW green field, would it have the market numbers to be a development target?

This is nothing to do with the capabilities of OSX, just a plain business decision about market share and ROI.

Exactly right!

I expect Logic to be discontinued any day now. :wink:

While anything is possible, I think it is highly unlikely that Cubase will end up on Linux because it is difficult to make a good business case for it.

If Steinberg were considering porting to Linux there are 2 key questions that need to be answered.

  1. How much would adding a market segment for Linux increase development and support costs.
  2. How much additional revenue would having Cubase on Linux generate.
    To be viable the answer to 2 has to be greater than the answer to 1 plus a reasonable profit margin.

Looking at costs, the actual code development costs likely wouldn’t increase too much as that’s probably done on an OS independent platform. However the cost to validate the code likely goes up much more because instead of having a list of things that need to be checked/verified that has to be gone through twice it would need to be gone through three times. Also as we know from experience some problems only occur on a Mac or PC but not the other. You’d have to expect that Linux only problems would crop up which would increase support costs somewhat. Additionally there is a hidden cost related to development & validation. These would increase the development workload which would lengthen the the product development cycle. Right now Steinberg gets $150 or so about every 2 years from many (most?) of us for upgrades. If, for example, the development cycle increases to 2.5 years that results in a 25% reduction in their revenue stream.

Even without access to Steinberg’s actual numbers, it makes sense that their costs would increase by a non-trivial amount. But of course if they make a ton more money then those costs would be a wise investment.

Looking at increased revenue, it is dependent on how much the customer base expands due to offering Cubase on Linux. Now a bunch of folks on this thread have very enthusiastically stated how much they’d love to run Cubase on Linux. Guess what, you probably don’t count on the revenue side of the equation. Since you are on the forum, presumably you already are using Cubase. If you switch from using Cubase on a PC to using it on a Linux box you aren’t expanding the customer base. Rather you are shifting from one market segment to another (which is revenue neutral assuming the produce is priced the same on all platforms) . The only customers who’d really increase revenue are those folks who A) would buy Cubase on Linux but not buy it on a PC or Mac or B) buy a license to run on Linux in addition to having a license on a PC or Mac. That’s the entire pool of potential extra revenue and I’d bet it is pretty small. Note that this is different than what percentage of the installed OS market is on Linux.

Finally that potential pool of new customers is further reduced because all DAWs need a technical ecosystem in order to thrive. Audio interfaces, controller interfaces, third-party audio plug-ins and VSTi’s, dongles/security etc. are necessary tools that we all require. So now you’ve gotta find that guy who will only use Cubase on Linux and doesn’t care that Waves, RME, NI, UAD and all the rest are not available. Sure you can hope to convince Waves et. al. to support Linux but that’s unlikely. First all those companies would need to confront the increased-costs vs. additional revenue issues themselves. Second there is a chicken-and-the-egg problem - who is going to develop Linux plugs if there isn’t a platform to run them on; and who is going to develop that platform if there aren’t any good plugs for use on that platform. Heck, Steinberg can’t even convince developers to support note-expression which is much less of an “ask.”

While Cubase on Linux might be technically and aesthetically attractive, it’s hard to see how it is economically viable.