Cut-away Scores: What is and isn't possible to recreate from this in Dorico?

Hi, newly transitioning from Finale to Dorico. I recently made this in Finale and want to share an excerpt from the score to get your thoughts on what is and isn’t feasible to do here in Dorico. I have combed through forums looking for tricks and workarounds for the various elements, but figured it would be most helpful to share what I am working with and gauge the community on how it might be done fully or as close as possible in Dorico.

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for starters, cut-away scores are not really possible :slight_smile:

Yeah cutaway scores are about the only thing that isn’t possible in Dorico right now. Although some people have figured out hack-ish workarounds or partial ones for cutaway.

We know that there are some significant gaps in Dorico’s capabilities when it comes to these kinds of contemporary techniques (if mid-century techniques can now be considered contemporary!), and those are a high priority for us to close in future.

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While not the official solution announced by Daniel, cutout scores can be done with a workaround, consisting in text covering the background (if needed, with a paragraph style including a white background):

The hiding text block has to be carefully positioned in Engrave mode, but then it moves with the score. If music is inserted or reformatted before the passage, the cutout blocks have to be manually repositioned. Hence the strong need for an official solution.

Paolo

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Har, har … re cutaway scores! :smile:

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Whenever I see these kind of scores, i always wonder how the engraver is going to extract parts, or add cues.

I have an idea about how this might be accomplished in Dorico (as it is currently configured) but I will need to experiment a bit before sharing.

Not really difficult. Parts show multibar rests, with the necessary cues where needed.

Paolo

But it is kinda fun to think about having those parts laid out with the cut-away gaps…! :slightly_smiling_face:

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When cutaway scores are supported in Dorico, it will be possible to have cutaways in parts if you really want to. There are some pieces for solo piano where one staff or the other is cut away, and we’ll support that too.

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“Violas, why didn’t you enter in bar 113…?!?!?!”

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… that’s hilarious!

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I have a serious question, for those who know, that relates to Dorico development:

What is the practice for cutaway scores when everyone is silent? Just show rest in the next staves that play? And perhaps those that played previous to the silence? Can anyone provide an example?

Hmm…I can’t readily think of such a spot. Let me go peruse some B&H Stravinsky scores…


In this case, the Postlude to Stravinsky’s Requiem Canticles, all of the fl/pno/hp/hn chords come “out of nowhere,” including after all-ensemble whole-bar rests in mm. 293, 298, and (not shown) 303. (I have always found it odd that the horn is notated at the bottom.)

In Stravinsky’s Variations Aldous Huxley in Memoriam, at the ends of variations those parts that had just been playing show bar rests, others are cut away. Within a variation, parts ending are cut away while those that will be entering have bar rests beforehand.

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Thanks for the example – But this is not quite fully a cutaway score, since the bottom ensemble is written throughout, right? Any others?

P.S.

We can already do this pretty much with adding & subtracting staves, yes?

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It is on those two pages, but it’s cut away on the page before.

ADDENDUM: Honestly, the Canticles scores is a bit odder in how it handles when and where things are cut away or not than some of his others. Just when I think I’ve gleaned a logic — such as the fact that all of the instruments in that passage I shared are “tolling bells” meant to ring on — then I can turn around and find him doing the same thing with resting trombones.

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and while it might “look cool”, the couple of conductors I’ve spoken to about cutaway scores have told me they absolutely loathe them.
I know that’s not an exhaustive sampling. but it’s still worth knowing that at least SOME conductors will hate you for handing them a cutaway orchestral score.

The only time I’ve really found cutaway to be useful has been in a few piano pieces where a third staff has been needed for a tiny number of bars.
But then, I don’t exactly write the most avantgarde music either.

just for fun, I took a really tonal score (using Finale) and turned it into a cutaway score. It was hysterical because it was pretentiously “modern” looking… despite being about as tonal as they come.

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Some conductors hate me no matter what I hand them.

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@dacronboy8 , I hope you’re enjoying your “Dorico adventures” this week. I was a 32-year Finale user, but made the transition two years ago. It was pretty disorienting even not happen under duress. I hope it’s going well for you!

I hope you don’t mind that I added “Cut-away Scores:” to the front of your thread title. It’s a significantly unique feature that I thought it would warrant a title that would bring it up more readily in searches.

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I feel as you do about such scores, but certainly

  • Our opinions are not going to stop the many composers who use this, and
  • With Finale as a tool being taken away from them, we’re going to be hearing about it increasingly here at Dorico
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