Feature Request / Proposal: VST System Link Hardware Converter for External Sync (LTC/MTC/Video Ref)

Nuendo
,
1

Although quite some time has passed since the development and sales of the Sync Station were discontinued, we still lack a way to achieve tight, frame-accurate synchronization with external non-Steinberg hardware.

This presents a major issue not only for film industry studios built around Pro Tools systems, but also for multi-camera video shoots.

While developing a synchronizer as comprehensive as the Sync Station might be difficult today, would it be realistic to develop a hardware unit that locks to Video Ref, receives positional information via LTC or MTC, and outputs a VST System Link signal at any sampling frequency supported by Steinberg products?

If this were realized, it would enable seamless synchronization not just for Nuendo, but across the entire Cubase series as well.

Although transport control for peripherals can be handled via MMC or RS422, this hardware would not only eliminate sync drift and drastically reduce lockup times, but also make near sample-accurate synchronization possible.

In large-scale workflows that cannot be completed using Steinberg products alone, reliable synchronization is an indispensable requirement.

I would love to hear everyone’s thoughts on this.

2

To synchronize a Steinberg DAW network via VST System Link using external hardware timecode—such as LTC, MTC, or video reference—a dedicated master synchronizer is required to convert external analog or digital timecodes into sample-accurate digital audio stream data or MTC.

Steinberg Ships Nuendo Sync Station Synchronizer Solution: The ultimate legacy hardware unit (developed in collaboration with Colin Broad) featuring inputs for LTC, MTC, Word Clock, Video Black Burst, HD Tri-Level Sync, Sony 9-Pin, and VST System Link via AES/EBU or S/PDIF. (Note: Discontinued and hard to find on the used market, yet it remains the definitive native solution).

Rosendahl WIF / TC-5B / MIF4: Professional European studio synchronizers that interface MTC, LTC, Word Clock, and video references.

DOREMiDi MTC-20 / SMPTE-to-MIDI boxes: Modern compact units that perform bidirectional LTC-to-MTC conversion via USB/MIDI DIN, but do not natively process multi-channel VST system link data bits.

Gleitkomma-Instruments Multiclock: Excellent for sample-accurate DAW synchronization of sample rates and clock rates, featuring plug-in integration for precise DAW alignment. The Multiclock is still being sold, but the company Floatingpoint Instruments no longer exists.

VST System Link (VSL)
Synchronisation
3

Not true. I still use the motu dtp and have several around. Sync anything to anything including mixtures of frame and sample accurate combinations (frame accurate at cubendos themselves), run the Cubendo transports in ext sync to the master clocking controlling the interfaces, even if one of the Cubendos is master time etc.

vst system link is not a necessary (nor desirable) experiment route imo.

In these days and times, I don’t envision a supportable market for new boxes as there are plenty of older units around. Never tried sync station as it seemed less capable than the dtp units imo.

4

Thank you, everyone, for sharing your thoughts.

In my opinion, the essential condition for external synchronization is that the DAW’s audio output must align perfectly with the master clock.
However, equipment other than the SyncStation merely converts incoming LTC or MTC from an external source into signals that the DAW can read.
Furthermore, serial communications such as MIDI or USB inherently suffer from timing jitter due to their specifications.
While LTC also has a similar kind of jitter to some extent, absolute precision is achieved by combining it with Video Reference technology—an analog approach that locks to absolute positions via frame edges on a macro level compared to serial communication timing fluctuations.

The reason I recommended VST System Link is that, in my experience, it is the easiest way to transmit both the Clock Reference and Positional Reference, achieving near sample-accurate synchronization.
In Nuendo or Cubase, as long as you can connect via PCM—regardless of the transmission format—synchronization can be set up very easily.

I use multiple units such as the SyncStation, NanoSyncs, and CB P2MMC; however, unfortunately, the SyncStation is the only device I can truly trust when it comes to synchronizing with external products.
Because of this situation, I believe it will be impossible to break Pro Tools’ absolute dominance in the industry.

As a side note, if this were an open architecture like ASIO or VST, it would allow synchronization with any software or hardware beyond just Steinberg products.

5

I strongly support Showgo’s proposal.

When it comes to synchronization, I think the requirements can vary greatly depending on the profession, workflow, size of the studio, and the level of accuracy each user actually needs.

Some users may never encounter synchronization problems at all. For others, synchronization via MTC or LTC may be perfectly sufficient.

And perhaps, on a global scale, users who truly require sample-accurate synchronization and precise locking to video reference represent a very small niche.

But for some of us, it is still essential.

The reason I need this functionality in Nuendo is that I mainly work in professional audio post-production environments, particularly large dubbing stages where multiple systems need to operate in synchronization.

In this field, systems built around Avid Pro Tools and Satellite Link have become extremely widespread.

Since the SyncStation was discontinued, there have been very few practical options for integrating Nuendo into a large professional dubbing stage with the same level of synchronization accuracy expected from a Pro Tools-based system.

This is not about whether Nuendo is better than Pro Tools, or whether Pro Tools is better than Nuendo.

It is about preserving the ability for professionals to choose which DAW they want to use, even in high-end audio post-production environments.

I have been using Nuendo professionally for many years, and as long as my SyncStation continues to work, I intend to continue working with Nuendo.

But the SyncStation has already been discontinued.

At some point, the hardware itself may fail. Or future changes in operating systems, drivers, or software may eventually make it impossible to use.

When that day comes, I may be forced to choose another DAW — not because I am dissatisfied with Nuendo itself, but simply because I can no longer build the synchronization environment required for my work.

The number of users who require sample-accurate synchronization may indeed be small.

But being a small group does not mean that the requirement itself is unimportant.

There are still professional, large-scale audio post-production facilities where this level of synchronization is essential.

And Steinberg already has the underlying technology: VST System Link.

SyncStation itself demonstrated how System Link technology could be used to achieve highly accurate synchronization.

That is why I sincerely hope Steinberg will consider something along the lines of Showgo’s proposal: a modern solution that carries forward the System Link technology and the synchronization role that SyncStation once provided.

Showgo, thank you for bringing attention to this issue and for turning it into a concrete proposal.

I strongly support this request.

6

Hi everyone,

I am setting up a small-scale professional dubbing workflow and need advice on achieving tight, frame-accurate synchronization between Nuendo 13 (running as the master recording DAW on a Mac Studio M1 Ultra with macOS Tahoe 26.2) and Mosaic 2 (running as the video slave on a Windows 11 PC).

My main audio interface on the Mac is an RME Fireface UFX+. I have tested several MIDI Timecode (MTC) configurations to drive Mosaic 2, but the transport responsiveness and sync tightness fall short of professional dubbing standards.

What I’ve Tested So Far:

Hardware MIDI (RME UFX+ \rightarrow Roland UM-ONE): Connected the MIDI Out of the RME Fireface UFX+ on the Mac directly to the PC via a Roland UM-ONE USB-MIDI interface.

Hardware MIDI (RME UFX+ \rightarrow MOTU M6): Routed MIDI Out from the UFX+ into a MOTU M6 audio interface on the PC side.

The Issue:

Across all these MTC setups, the result is identical: noticeable start/stop latency, sluggish scrubbing, and the rhythm strip in Mosaic 2 takes time to catch up whenever I move the playhead or loop a section in Nuendo 13.

I need a reliable, pro-grade solution that offers instant transport response, zero-jitter start, and perfect frame-accurate tracking.

Two Potential Solutions I’m Considering:

1. Dual USB-to-RS422 Adapters (Sony 9-Pin Direct Bridge):

Using two Moxa UPort 1130 (FTDI chip) USB-to-RS422 converters (one on the Mac Studio as Sony 9-Pin Master in Nuendo 13, one on the PC as Slave), linked directly via a custom 5-wire crossed cable (TX \rightarrow RX, RX \rightarrow TX, GND).

Question: Has anyone successfully used this direct RS-422 bridge with Nuendo 13 for broadcast-level Machine Control without a dedicated sync clock hardware?

2. Steinberg Nuendo SyncStation:

Buying a second-hand Steinberg SyncStation.

Question: Is the SyncStation still fully operational with Nuendo 13 on modern Apple Silicon hardware running macOS Tahoe 26.2? Would it offer a significant performance upgrade over the dual RS-422 adapter setup for Sony 9-Pin control, or is it overkill for a direct Mac-to-PC link?

Would you recommend the dual Moxa RS-422 approach, or should I hunt down a SyncStation for this setup?

Thanks in advance for your insights!

7

Rabah_Bentolba

First, let me explain the basics of synchronization.

RS422, MTC, and USB are all serial communications, meaning they cannot transmit exact time timing. Of course, the communication speed is fast enough to transmit clock information, but there is an allowable margin of jitter.

In a professional video environment, an analog video reference signal is used to fully synchronize time information, ensuring that the edge of each frame output from the system is perfectly aligned. As you know, this signal operates at relatively low frequencies such as 24 or 59.94, which is crucial—if the frequency were too high, it would become impossible to identify the specific frame edge to align with.

While the SyncStation offers extremely high sync accuracy, transport control is heavily influenced by the connected equipment. Also, since it is EOS (End of Support), support for the latest macOS is unlikely.

Regarding your question: for the reasons stated above, perfect synchronization is impossible unless a video reference can be fed into both the DAW and the video player. However, it is also true that this does not immediately mean it is unusable for professional work. Any drift below the threshold of human perception will not pose a major issue for most tasks.

As for transport issues, there is likely little difference between RS422 and MMC. I have never used the Mosaic 2 you mentioned, so I cannot say for certain, but scrub response can sometimes be poor depending on its specifications (Pro Tools being a prime example). In a typical professional setup, the configuration is often “Video as Sync Master, DAW as Controller.”

First, is it possible to use the Video Track in your NUENDO?

If your PC lacks the processing power to handle video playback, I recommend installing Nuendo or Cubase on a second PC to act as a dedicated video player and linking them via VST System Link. In this setup, you can set the DAW (for audio editing) as the Master and the Video Player as the Slave. The Fireface UFX+ features AES/EBU, MADI, and ADAT digital I/O; you can connect digital audio to the Video Player PC using any unused port. For the Video Player side, simply prepare an audio interface with minimal ASIO support to receive the signal (Optical S/PDIF options tend to be inexpensive).

Once both units are configured, you should achieve a fairly seamless workflow.

I hope this helps.

8

Semi-off-topic side-note: It’s worth noting that VSL’s Vienna Ensemble Pro works as a fully syncable video player, too, since the release of V8 earlier this year (… plus other goodies like MCP support for AI-integration etc.):

https://www.vsl.co.at/products/software/vienna-ensemble-pro-8v

9

I have been using Nuendo in exactly the sort of configuration described above for years. Usually one or two Nuendo rigs as players, and at least one PT rig (the Recorder, but sometimes as extra players too). We would use a mix of RS 422 (Nuendo master rig with Syncstation to CB Electronic SR-4 synchroniser, ProTools recorder with USB-RS422 adapter to SR4, VST SystemLink between Nuendo rigs, Satellite Link between PT rigs)
At first (2004) we used the Steinberg Timebase which… didn’t actually work for about 18 months before someone decided to update the firmware :person_facepalming:
We were then super happy to see the Syncstation come out. Designed (and probably built by) Colin Broad, a master when it comes to all things RS422 and tri-level sync.
That worked well for many years.
But…
Mac OS seems to have broken the Syncstations super tight sync in RS 422. Now sync floats when recording the 2-pop from Nuendo to the PT recorder. Very disappointing.

The best, and tightest, sync I now have for syncing Nuendo to PT is… MTC over Ethernet. But that means that PT is not resolving to the SyncHD (ie. video ref) as PT cannot have a Network MIDI MTC input AND a SyncHD (so stupid).
However, using this, the 2-pop and mix is repeatedly perfectly in sync. Caveat is that ProTools slaving to MTC doesn’t locate on stop, or when clicking around in the Nuendo session.

10

Dietz I’ve been wondering about your suggested setup. From what I can see its reliant on a separate MTC source, right?

Scrubbing/transport is sluggish with MTC when compared to VST System Link between machines (my current setup), which is really tight and apparently sample accurate.

Ideally there would be VSL equivalent to VST System Link running via the VEPro plugin master and slave via ethernet that contains sample accurate sync. So here, I dont mean MTC over the same ethernet link embedded in the VSL data, I’m referring to sample accurate sync with tight transport behaviour. Is this present or planned?

11

VE Pro acts like a VST instrument. The external video player is still part of the Nuendo-Project, so to speak, tightly integrated, reflecting every move - even if it’s running on a dedicated machine.

AFAIK there are demo licenses available, just give it a try. If you’re missing options, talk to VSL’s developers.

12

Thanks Ive been running VEPro for many years. I did buy the license for 8V because I thought VSL had developed a sample accurate sync protocol via the proprietary data between the master and slave plugins. There is no info on it though and I took a punt and I totally own that.

But so far the settings I’m presented with (requiring me to send MTC from the host DAW PC to a specified port on the server PC) gives loose chasing MTC sync like all other DAWs can. With a relatively sluggish transport and scrubbing response.

I think VSL should be more forthcoming about the fact that it is MTC sync only, and that its not sent internally over the VSL network protocol between VEPro plugins. It requires us to provide our own MIDI end points for the MTC flow.

Its still useful as is of course, especially for composing which doesnt really need sample accuracy, and it’s great that VEPro can use a BM decklink card. But these days composing also includes sound design, that would benefit from tight sync and ultra responsive transport/scrubbing that VST System Link and Avid Satellite Link offer.

In the end I still find myself using VST System Link to run the video on another machine (my VEPro synth machine with BM decklink card) for that better response and accuracy. Although this solution isnt as responsive and tight as Protools > Video Sync 6 (using Avid Satellite Link)

13

I made VSL’s developers aware of your suggestions already. :slight_smile:

14

Modernizing VST System Link would of course be ideal, but separately from that, could Avid Satellite Link compatibility be implemented in Nuendo as a paid optional feature?

If Avid is willing to license the protocol, Steinberg would not necessarily need to reinvent everything from scratch.

Similar to how certain features such as DNxHD were previously offered as additional licensed options, this could also be offered as a paid option that only professional users who need it would purchase.

Of course, this would not be a replacement for the sample-accurate synchronization offered by VST System Link.

However, I think it could be extremely useful in situations where Nuendo needs to participate in a dubbing system built around Satellite Link, or for integration with ADR systems that support Satellite Link, such as Mosaic.

15

Please be aware that neither MTC nor SMPTE/LTC provides sample-accurate synchronization by itself.

At 25 fps, SMPTE/LTC has a frame resolution of 40 ms. MTC transmits timecode using quarter-frame messages, with a complete timecode value transmitted over two frames (80 ms at 25 fps), although this delay can normally be compensated for by the receiving system.

So sample-accurate sync is not possible based on timecode alone. For that, you need a common clock/reference in addition to positional timecode.

HTH

Fredo

16

+1 for licensing Satellite Link

17

I get a bit confused over the complaints on this thread.

Are people proposing rock solid sample-accurate lock of everything they have (never needed that myself in 40+ years of sync)…or…are people complaining they can’t get rock solid frame-accurate sync? (which I have possessed in my systems for decades)…or…are people complaining of no-substitute-gizmo-for-discontinued-steinberg-box…which itself was never a pure sample-accurate box anyway?

Don’t say “all of the above” :slight_smile:

As I mentioned somewhere, I still use multiple motu dtp synchronizers in conjunction with (also) multiple smpte motor synchronizers to flawlessly frame-lock…say…multiple 24trk 2" machines…with multiple da88 type machines (still have a few of this type)…with…multiple slaved Cubase 14…synchronized to, say…a Nuendo 14 slave…synchronized to, say…another Nuendo 14 (that’s three separate win 11 computers but I can go more, being I have 6 licenses).

I CAN and HAVE run them all at the same time (all transports) although not normally doing that as I tend to utilize a few Cubendo machines only as reverb hosts or vsti hosts (ala the old vstack concept)…for example, all my vsl etc stuff sits on its own win11 system.

but…

point is, the dtp is master clock and it feeds the word clock ins …or 9pin ins…or…anything else to be absolute rock-solide frame accurate master clock.

Mtc on Cubendos is ONLY positional. Not clock. Even whatever singular Cubendo machine I place into master mode for the transport is NOT the master clock. Its wordclock output only feeds the dtp…which IS the master clock for everybody. I can add video machines in as well although I don’t.

I get no drift, ever. All frame accurate all the time.

Personally, I’ve never needed sample-accurate “anything” and was fairly turned off when I set up a few vst systemlink routings between cubendo machines years ago…simply not necessary.

At any rate…it seems core complaints on this thread aren’t over a thing of consensus…but I’ll tell you, nothing drops out ever…if your clocking is complete.

As an aside, I haven’t followed the topic much, but I believe a couple of gens from now (during next 10 years or so) have the usb spec moving to a continually resolving clock format or something instead of packets…designed specifically to solve clocking complaints back here in the 2020s.

Regardless, everyday rock solid frame-accurate transport sync…and generalized clock sync between systems passing audio…is routine if one wants it…at least for motor-driven tape/video machines and/or connected multiple Windows machines. (can’t speak for Mac…don’t care about that universe).

18

I think we may be looking for slightly different things.

I understand that you are satisfied with what your current system configuration can achieve.

What I am concerned with, however, is post-production / ADR operation, where video is always part of the workflow.

There are situations where I need to synchronize tape machines, video playback machines, third-party DAWs, consoles, and various other systems.

For me, it is not only about avoiding drift, but also about having stable, repeatable playback position at sample-level accuracy, and about how tightly Transport, video playback, and ADR systems can be integrated across multiple DAWs.

In that sense, I see VST System Link and Satellite Link-style integration as two different things.

As Fredo said, if Video Reference cannot be received, I think it is difficult to achieve a high level of synchronization accuracy.

For users who do not need that level of accuracy, a simpler setup similar to Satellite Link without an Avid SYNC X may be perfectly sufficient.

On the other hand, I hope Steinberg will also listen to users who do need higher accuracy.

If a successor to SyncStation were ever developed, it would be ideal if it also included an Ethernet port for Satellite Link-style integration.

If machine control, Video Reference, and sample-accurate synchronization could all be integrated, I think it could become a system that goes even further than SYNC X.

19

I understand that each of your workflows operates in a unique environment with its own required level of precision.

As Fredo and nabw pointed out, without a clock reference based on frame rate in addition to a positional reference, the synchronization accuracy will likely remain around the level of Pro Tools without Sync X. Paradoxically, why do Pro Tools users (or the manufacturer) need Sync X in the first place? It is simply because there are people who work in environments that demand true, high-precision synchronization with external hardware.

For example, a signal set to 01:00:00:00 in Nuendo must trigger at the exact same timing across all synchronized equipment. Particularly in the film industry—where Pro Tools is commonly used as a dubbing recorder—bringing in Nuendo can be met with reluctance if it only syncs via MIDI or SMPTE LTC, which are far inferior to Pro Tools’ synchronization precision.

As for external control, it is a different matter altogether, yet equally vital for maximizing operational efficiency. In that regard, I feel Satellite Link is remarkably well executed.

My hope is for Nuendo to remain a standardized, professional option viable across diverse production environments, rather than just a handy tool restricted to niche workflows.