Forcing Duration on tied notes

I’m trying to tie the selected note (a dotted crotchet) to a minim, which is itself tied from the previous bar.

Force Duration is ON. I’ve tried re-entering the notes, but every time I end up with a double dotted minim, or some other assortment.

How can I get the notes I Want? I’ve tried various Notation Options, but I might want generally Options that are at odds with this particular bar.
Screenshot 3.png

Delete the notes. Delete the ties.
Turn on force duration.
Set the caret and type exactly the following
8 C T 6 . C

Alternatively, Notation Options, Note Grouping, set the maximum number of rhythm dots to 1 (the default is 2).

No, that doesn’t work. Even with Force Duration, I get double dots.

That works, thanks. Though what if I need double dots somewhere else…?

I think with force duration on, you might be able to input them. If you press alt and the key for the dot (on my french keyboard, it’s ; but I think on yours it should be dot) you can change the number of dots to the note. Since force duration overrides the global behavior of Dorico, it should work, but I confess I have not tried it.

Some other notation options must be interacting with this. I just tried exactly what Leo said, in the score I happened to be working on, and I got a half tied to a quarter tied to an 8th - and you don’t want that either!

I don’t have the time or the inclination to play with this any more just now, though.

In that case just get even more specific, and prescribe the minims on either side of the bar line.

7 C T 7 C T 6 . C

Yes, that does work. But the point is that with Force Duration ON, whatever I type should be what I get, regardless of the Options.

Yes, but you have to prescribe EVERYTHING if Force Duration is on. If you start with some notes that weren’t entered with Force Duration, they won’t magically become Forced when you add a Forced tie. Likewise, the reason that my original suggestion didn’t work is that by turning on Force Duration and typing 8, you’re asking for a semibreve. If that’s split over a barline then Dorico can’t magically know HOW you want it split.

So I suppose if the Dorico interface was 100% logical, pressing 8 would have either been ignored, or produced an error message because you can’t do that.

Or (as in Lilypond, and it’s actually a useful option for typsetting 16th-century music in its original format) it would create a whole note where you told it to, and advance the cursor four beats to the middle of the next bar!

Ah: I get it: because Dorico has split the semibreve, Forced Duration is essentially OFF for this note.

Fair enough. It’s just something to remember. Having particular note values (and particular accidentals) is very important to me, so I’m trying to minimize the ‘helping’ in this regard.

I just finished a piece which required lots of Force Duration, with instruments doubling the same passage. The only way I could get it to work reliably was to input in Force Duration with no ties; then, copy to the other instrument; then, go back and insert ties in each part. If I tied notes together before copying, sometimes (but weirdly not always) the tied notes would be regrouped.

My suspicion, Steven, is that the hidden tuplets didn’t help. When copying tuplets you MUST select the number/ratio as well as the notes, and if the number/ratio is hidden then you MUST select the signpost. If the signposts are hidden then they won’t get copied.

Yes - not copying the signposts did indeed screw me up several times! But even if I did copy them, sometimes a tied passage would be re-barred when I copied it, and I would have to redo it. This is to be fair a pretty bizarre use case (Nancarrow).